When “good” feminists do nothing

Wendy McElroy; Warren Farrell; Erin Pizzey; Christina Hoff Sommers.

These are the names of people who are among a very small minority of individuals associated with feminism that truly care about the discrimination both men and women face within western societies. If you were to mention these names to the majority of mainstream feminists, “right wing-nut,” “anti-woman,” or “who are they?” would most likely be the response you receive. You see, to mainstream feminism, which is made up of both “radical” and “moderate” feminists, anyone who dares to place even the smallest hint of blame on the feminist movement for the discrimination men face is a misogynist by default, even feminists.

Not too long ago I wrote an article listing the core beliefs of the feminist movement. These core beliefs are of course misandric as they all blame and demonize the male half of the population for whatever problems women face. Everything listed in that article is the motivation behind most of the things done by the feminist movement. Every law and policy that strips men of their civil freedoms is justified by the theories and bigotry created by feminism. The most elusive of these theories; Patriarchy, is an ever-changing, ever-evolving mesh of hate and bigotry that has shared many different definitions. The reasoning behind these changes is the focus of this article; “good” feminists. To start, I will list a fact most good feminists would like you to ignore.

Most forms of feminism characterize patriarchy as an unjust social system that is oppressive to women. As feminist and political theorist Carole Pateman writes, “The patriarchal construction of the difference between masculinity and femininity is the political difference between freedom and subjection.” In feminist theory the concept of patriarchy often includes all the social mechanisms that reproduce and exert male dominance over women. Feminist theory typically characterizes patriarchy as a social construction, which can be overcome by revealing and critically analyzing its manifestations.

Feminists twisted the definition of patriarchy from the simple meaning of a society in which families share a husband and father’s last name and property to a society in which women are an oppressed class and slaves to men. “Good” feminists will deny this. Not because it is a lie. It’s  an irrefutable truth. No, they will deny it because it shines a bad light on feminism. They will tell you the most current meaning that some “moderate” feminists are using. They will tell you that patriarchy doesn’t mean men are oppressors; patriarchy is a class system in which women are on the bottom. To be honest, I don’t see the difference.

Because there isn’t one.

“Good” feminists will tell you that just because women are on the bottom of this patriarchal class system, it doesn’t mean that men don’t suffer too. This is where the “good feminists” either don’t get it or hope that you don’t get it. Claiming that western societies are built on class systems where all men are automatically above all women is the same bigotry as claiming men are the oppressive overlords of women. Claiming that western societies are patriarchal because men have privileges while ignoring or denying the privileges women have is the same bigotry as claiming men are oppressive overlords.

Women. Are. Not. Fucking. Oppressed.

There are two laws in the United States that allow men to do things that women cannot. One is walking the streets topless and the other is being granted the “privilege” of being given a job where the objective is to either kill an opposing force or die on a battlefield.

They. Were. Never. Fucking. Oppressed.

Most “good” feminists, the ones I have spoken with at least, would agree with my above statement. That’s where the agreements usually end. Recently, “moderate” feminist websites and articles have sprung up attempting to put out a different kind of message than the usual “men are bad” that has been the tagline associated with feminism for decades. Now feminists suddenly care about the discrimination millions of men have suffered through for decades. Well actually, they don’t. These new blogs and articles do the same things the bigots that marched through the streets forty years ago holding “men are pigs” signs did.

Honestly, I’d prefer someone to tell me they hate me to my face instead of dressing it up in backwards theories. You will notice that the only place most “good feminists” can be found is the Internet. They aren’t marching through the streets holding “VAWA-reform” signs or at the doors of domestic violence organizations demanding men be given equal advocacy and help. No. “Good feminists” are online commenting on MRA blogs and websites urging everyone there not to blame feminism for any of the legal discrimination men face in western societies.

According to “good” feminists we should forget about the feminist run domestic violence organizations in California and West Virginia that actively denied all male victims of abuse help, falsified DV statistics, and ran a PSA ad campaign which only featured male perpetrators and female victims. We shouldn’t blame feminism for that. No, those feminists were “radicals” and it was an isolated incident.

Of course we would have to also ignore the National Organization for Women, who continually put out the message that domestic violence is a gendered crime that mostly women suffer. We shouldn’t blame feminism for that bigotry, even though N.O.W is the largest feminist organization in North America. All of them are just “radicals” and feminism as a movement is in no way the cause of any of the bigoted laws or policies (VAWA) created by them, right?

Let’s move on to colleges. A new standard has swept North America in which college men, and only college men have been stripped of their right to be considered innocent until proven guilty. Before this most recent act of bigotry against men hit colleges another disgusting practice had already been implemented where all male college freshmen and only male college freshmen are required to attend an anti-rape course where they are treated as potential rapists. If they refuse they can say goodbye to their academic future. None of this is because of the constant rape hysteria people are bombarded with from feminism, according to “good” feminists. In fact, feminists who attend or are associated with colleges are all of the “third wave” variety. You know, the “sex positive” “moderate feminists” of the new millennium. They would never stand for any bigotry against either gender. That is, unless those who are among the gender with penises decide to make a group dedicated to male issues. Then the “moderate” feminists will have a problem.

Pointing out feminist bigotry is useless with feminists of any variety. Your response from a “radical” will be fuck off, your response from a “moderate” will be “you don’t understand feminism,” and your response from a “good feminist” will be “none of the feminists I know are like that.”

Why is any of this important? Because while the Men’s Rights Movement wasn’t born on the Internet, it is the Internet that allowed those who wish to end feminist bigotry a chance to spread their message worldwide and uncensored. Can anyone think of, or more importantly, find a newspaper article or television PSA that acknowledges the fact that men are not the only rapists and domestic abusers on planet Earth, before the year 2000? Can anyone find one today?

Without the Internet, most of the world would be ignorant to the fact that the feminist claim about 1 and 4 women being raped is a fabrication. A fabrication used to garner government money with which to fund a hate campaign against men.

The Internet is not where the resistance to feminist bigotry began, but it is where that resistance continues to grow because every time a feminist steps in front of a news camera and makes a blatantly false claim about domestic violence, such as 90% of it being committed by men, hundreds of websites around the world will light up with the truth. Every day, more and more men and women read these websites and every day, more and more men and women realize that feminism does indeed deserve the blame all of those “angry ex-husbands” from the “abusers lobby” have placed on it. That is why all of these feminist blogs are suddenly popping up with the claim of caring about male issues.

They are attempting to place a smokescreen in front of the association the feminist movement has with the discrimination against men. They are attempting to prevent the growing anger the people of western societies hold because of male suffering from being directed towards feminism. But they won’t ever cross the line of calling out feminist bigotry because if they do their names within mainstream feminist communities will fade into obscurity and only be mentioned in reference to “anti-woman” rants. This is why their attempts will fail.

It is important that those who run these MRA websites do not falter to the growing invasion of “good” feminists who are in no way good. It is possible to have a discussion about male issues and propose positive solutions to these issues without ever mentioning feminism. This is something I have never denied because it is the truth. However, it is fucking impossible to have a discussion about all male issues without mentioning feminism because feminism is the direct and indirect cause of several issues men face in western societies today. So if you create a “feminist friendly” website about male issues and don’t want to have anyone call out feminism for its part in the problems men face then I suggest you limit your topics to circumcision and selective service and have at it.

That is the only way you will appease your “good” feminist friends because the moment false rape allegations, VAWA, the sentencing disparity between male and female criminals, the wage gap lie, affirmative action, the lowered standards some jobs incorporate to fill female quotas, paternity fraud, family court, or forced child support is mentioned, your “good” feminist friends will go into defensive mode. They will attempt to explain away the bigotry feminism, not “radicals” or “moderates” but feminism has caused. They will tell you your “feminist friendly” website about male issues is becoming “abusive.” They will tell you that your language is becoming misogynistic. They will be offended by how everything you say is anti-feminist, which in a lot of feminist minds is equal to anti-woman. Voicing the truth about how women can roundhouse kick their husbands/boyfriends in the side of the head and not receive any punishment and instead have their husbands/boyfriends arrested because of the feminist created VAWA will be categorized as “blaming women” for men’s problems. Voicing the truth about how false rape allegations are a growing epidemic will put you in the category of “rape apologists.”

Speaking of false rape allegations, as shown in the second link I placed in this article, feminists (moderate/radical/good/whatever) don’t feel that false rape allegations are a real problem. Either it isn’t an epidemic or it is in no way as bad or important as rape. To quote the author of the article I linked to, it just “sucks.” In any case, false accusers should never receive harsher punishments, according to “moderate feminists.”

Not too long ago it was legal to execute men accused of rape and today it is socially accepted to murder men accused of rape.

Men have been murdered and had their accusers later recant the lie that ended their lives out of guilt. I really don’t see how anyone can make light of a crime that leads to years of imprisonment, rape, abuse, beatings, and oh yeah, murder and claim to be in support of egalitarianism. I guess it’s because I don’t think like a feminist.

Speaking of egalitarianism, there is a new movement on the rise. The walk on wall street. Care to guess what the “third wave moderate” feminist element of that group is advocating? If you guessed bigotry on the highest scale then you would be correct because “It’s cool to think that racism and sexism are OK when we do them” according to “moderate” feminists.

Feminists, real world feminists, not Internet trolls, have ruined the lives of millions of men. They propose, create, and support bigoted policies like the ones overtaking North American colleges. They propagate that domestic violence is a gendered crime that only women suffer. They create PSAs that depict only men as abusers of women and children. They falsify and misrepresent statistics in order to garner funds from their government. They use their positions of authority within the law to conduct witch hunts on men accused of rape. They advocate that men should have no voice against any mutual discrimination both men and women face because men are too privileged by our “patriarchal society.” They propagated a girl crisis and claimed that our “patriarchal society” was the reason girls could not excel in school. They used this lie to reform western school systems where masculine behavior in boys, and only in boys, is discouraged and now when boys are in crisis, these feminists claim that it is because girls are just naturally better than boys academically.

And where are the “good” feminists? I’ll tell you where they are. They are busy telling you to stop focusing your blame on feminism. While it is true that not every individual feminist was actively involved in the hateful acts I listed above that doesn’t take away from the fact that the feminist movement is a major part of the reason why these things were allowed to happen and all of the “good feminists” who want to turn the public focus away from that fact are in my view worse than the radical feminist womyn who are at least up front about their hateful beliefs and intentions.

In my most recent article I stated that there can be no common ground between the Men’s Rights Movement and Feminism until feminists will acknowledge that feminism has created and spread legal discrimination against men throughout western societies and then advocate against it. Not with one obscure non-misandric blog article out of hundreds of misandric articles but with PSAs and real world activism on par with what Fathers and Families and S.A.V.E does. I’m still waiting.

About Jared White

Jared is a writer, activist, videographer and a lover of music. He is a regular contributor to A Voice for Men and a devout antifeminist. He is the webmaster at File 13 and his music site, Embracefreedom.com.

Main Website
View All Posts

Support us by becoming a member

AVFM depends on readers like you to help us pay expenses related to operations and activism. If you support our mission, please subscribe today.

Join or donate

Sponsored links

  • AntZ

    “In my most recent article I stated that there can be no common ground between the Men’s Rights Movement and Feminism until feminists will acknowledge that feminism has created and spread legal discrimination against men throughout western societies and then advocate against it.”

    I don’t see why there should ever be “common ground”. Maybe one day there can be respect and frank negotiation. But common ground? I don’t even want it.

    • http://jmnzz.wordpress.com Jared White

      There isn’t going to be any common ground. This was more me pointing out why there won’t be any instead of asking for it.

      • http://counterfem.blogspot.com Fidelbogen

        I would not advocate common ground, but I would make them the offer to ‘co-exist’, since I know perfectly well that they CANNOT DO THIS.

        But at least I made the offer.

        And if they cannot maintain their end of it. . . oh well!

    • http://www.manwomanmyth.com Perseus

      As an -‘ism’, “femin-ism” is from its inception, from the word go, by its very charter and definition, a self-centric entity of genetic pride, chauvinism, bigotry, supremacy, subjugation and domination. These are by the very nature of the word, femin-ism, which is actually a misnomer and is accurately “female-ism.” “Feminism” rejects any definition of femininity, rejects any attempts at such a concept as being socially contrived and imposed, therefore such a word has no place in the name of the ideology. What we know as “feminism” concerns itself only with what is genetically female, therefore it is properly labeled and identified as femaleism. Language matters. Just as a small example of this, “femin-” as a prefix evokes “feminine” as a concept and this plays well into the blue pill disposition for chivalry. You can bet that female-ists are all too aware of this fact and employ the deceit willfully and strategically. But THEY are not in control. WE can identify and denote them accurately, femaleists, female supremacists.

      Femin-ism lies inherently in the class of rac-ism, chauvin-ism, sex-ism. Note that the male counterpart, mascul-ism, is not celebrated or openly peddled and never has been, only females exhibit such gross narcissism.

      Common ground with an entity of intrinsically and by definition pure evil and malice is nonsensical. What, precisely, would such “common ground” entail? A reduced tacit approval for bigotry? Not so much.

  • Merlin

    I won’t be advocating a common ground either…

    After more than for decades of feminists and feminism I just want to see the back of them. I’d like to see them driven into the seas for the damage they have done. There won’t be any forgiveness coming from me anytime soon.

  • Quartermain

    Good feminist is an oxymoron.

    • http://www.youtube.com/user/MassEFR34k J3DIforce1

      Yes it is. Them saying they do things differently than rad fems is like saying the KKK went from calling blacks the “N” word to people of color. They are still the KKK at the core no matter how much candy sprinkles they put on their shit.

    • http://thedamnedoldeman.com TDOM

      I disagree. A good feminist is just a plain old everyday moron.


      • Atlas Reloaded

        That makes ya wanna take some oxy…contin. Cuntin.

  • keyster

    They’ve consciously shifted their marketing/messaging to be more of a hip/cool “gender neutral” feminism. A “feminism everyone can love”, kind of message.
    This is because being a feminist is a turn off to guys, so if they can get more guys into the fold by appearing more “accepting”, they can more easily recruit young women.

    They do this by qualifying statements such as “rape is a problem for men too” and other other masked neutrality.

    A “good feminist” is a young woman who will pretend to show sexual interest in you if you agree with feminism; march in slutwalks and “take back the night” events.

    A “good feminist” cares about the concerns of men to the extent that its not at the expense of any “gains” feminism has made, or tries to make, (at the expense of men).

    • Bev

      They do this by qualifying statements such as “rape is a problem for men too” and other other masked neutrality.

      I agree with you however we should accept that these type statements are an advance on the situation faced by anti-feminists 10 or 15 years ago when I saw the light and started fighting feminism. They just ignored, censored what you said and failed to admit in any way that men had problems. Though as you say its a “cop out” at the very least they can no longer ignore men. Feminists have always had a special venom for women who opposed feminism and saw it as a betrayal of the sisterhood and other women. Feminists being the selfish self centred creatures they are cannot understand or accept that a woman would be ready to give up the so called “privilages” feminism has brought to women in the interests of getting rid of the social distortions which have caused such misery for all.

      • http://menzmagazine.blogspot.com/ Dan Moore (Factory)

        Thing is Bev they’ve already killed any chance of women going back to the ‘good old days’…if for no other reason than that men will not allow them to.

        Women in general have burnt up their social power with men, and it’s too late to ask for it back.

        Nope, nowadays women are going to have to provide real value in relationships, or be regarded as sextoy parasites (somewhat rightfully) by a lot of men.

        Women have reduced their own value to that of a prostitute to many men. And men are not about to fix it for them…nor should we.

        • Robert Full Of Rage

          I second your comment, Mr. Moore!

  • http://www.youtube.com/user/MassEFR34k J3DIforce1

    You mention the walk on wall street ordeal. I think for the most part its a good thing, however one thing I find disturbing about it is that there are some protesters crying out for socialism. The last thing ANY society needs is a form of government that has total control over the people. Also, I find it ironic that feminist are even there protesting at all, considering the very powers they are protesting played a roll in getting their movement off the ground.

    • Raven01

      Those would be young idealists mostly I hope.
      Socialism and communism are actually the best forms of governance………. in theory. In practice they seem even more susceptible to abuse than republics, democracies, or even monarchies.
      However, I am unlike you not surprised by feminist participation. What, afterall is a feminist but a woman who consistently bites the very hand that feeds her? The support they receive will dry up overnight the instant their usefulness runs out.

    • Anubis

      “The last thing ANY society needs is a form of government that has total control over the people.”

      Yes, but total control over the people doesn’t have to be straight forward in order to exist. Neither of the extremes is good.
      Same thing in our case, I think, in order to bring ourselves to the golden middle, the line that is between Yin and Yang we need to apply some opposite move.

  • Ben

    Much of society undoubtedly does want to see the murder of any man accused of rape. There is at least a large enough segment of the general public, who are selected for jury duty, with this level of emotionally governed rape hysteria mindset to make it a legitimate concern in all rape trials. How can any innocent man expect to get a fair trial in our current climate of rape hysteria?

    Recently, Yahoo News did a story about two US soldiers who were accused of raping two Asian women. I read the article several times and saw no incriminating evidence of any kind in the article, just mere accusations. Most of the comments underneath the story called for the two men to be castrated, executed, sent to prison for life, tortured by the girls’ fathers, etc. These comments were from people who had no other information than that the young men were accused.

    I simply left a comment asking, “What if they are innocent? Do you people not believe in due process and the presumption of innocence of the accused?” My comment was hidden due to low ratings within less than 30 minutes. The comments that advocated castration of the accused men recieved mostly up-votes. I received messages from women asking me how many women I had raped and the whole nine yards.

    “… male college freshmen are required to attend an anti-rape course where they are treated as potential rapists. If they refuse they can say goodbye to their academic future.” Truly disgusting. We have that class at my college but it is not required yet but it probably soon will.

    • Stu

      Most men who rave on about how men who are accused of rape should be bashed, castrated etc…..are very suspicious to me. Think about it, where does that mentality play out the most in reality…….in prison. Who are the mob leaders of these actions……hardened, long-term criminals. This mentality goes into turbo charged overdrive…….where the scum of the earth are gathered together.

      I am also very suspicious of these men who fly off on rants about pedophiles and pedophilia…..willing to hang, draw and quarter any man suffering accusation for the slightest reason. These guys fall into two categories in my mind. Those that are so low in the pecking order on the sexual menu…..or such unsavory characters that they can barely get laid in a whore house…..or…..have all these rape and pedophile tendencies themselves…….thus find it so easy to believe that every other man does also.

      With the first type, the violent rage and frothing at the mouth rants that they spew out at the slightest opportunity is just one big pussy begging exercise…….it’s like…..yes……I’m a loser……I’m unattractive….pathetic…..a miserable excuse for a man……..but look…..I have redeeming qualities……I’m an anti rape anti pedophilia hero…..who will commit violence to protect the women and children from all the evil men…….which is most men…….but not me. Yep, the one good man………you’re looking at him baby. I guess I get on the blow job list after all?

      The second type……are the ones who fantasize about raping their daughters friends……and hide away in private flogging it while watching downloaded kiddie porn…….and violent rape porn. Their protests are just one big smoke screen.

      • Elder Swami

        reminds me of that sicko from Snow Town

      • http://www.mensrightsboard.blogspot.com/ Masculist Man

        Good analysis,Stu.

        Can I repost this on my blog? Giving you full credit of course.

  • Stu

    Good Feminist is an oxymoron. There are good woman who call themselves feminists………but if they are good……they are deluded about the feminist part.

    If a woman is a feminist………which is a group that one has to volunteer to belong too…..and in volunteering to belong to that group, she volunteers to support all the misandry that is generated by that group…..then she is an evil bigot. There is no such thing as a good feminist. Even Hitlers Nazis have more claim to the word “good” in front of their Nazi title……at least many of them were forced…..not so with feminists.

    These woman like Sommers may call themselves feminists……but feminists don’t consider them to be feminists……most don’t even consider them to be legit women. They have all received death threats from the real feminists.

    • Raven01

      I concur. I find the same with McElroy. The words out of her mouth never follow the femi-stasi party line.
      I am at a loss here, much or what Pizzey and McElroy say rings true but like Jared I cannot reconcile myself to their voluntarily claimed tag of “feminist”, the vilest f-word to grace the english language.The question is, should we promote these people as the lesser evil?Personally, I will not. Atleast not as a “good feminist”, I will advocate for what points I believe they get right as a person but, with the hatred spread by feminism I cannot support them as a feminist. To me that would be akin to supporting the “good” Nazi’s or the “good” cannibals.

      • Stu

        I consider these women as women who got conned into feminism early on. They got involved believing all the egalitarian lines. Then when they find out they have been duped into working for hate movement…..they say…….oh no…..I am the true feminism…..those assholes are imposters . They hijacked my ideology and warped it into something else and call it feminism.

        They refuse to believe that the whole plan all along was to rope women into it…..once they have invested years of their lives and identities in this movement…..it is very hard to accept that they have been conned. Most women just ramp up their radicalism in lock step with the shakers and movers of the movement…….some drop out……some some fight for a more moderate feminism….and get the death threats that go with that. What they all need to do is accept the fact that they aren’t feminists……and never were…….they were useful idiots.

      • http://jmnzz.wordpress.com Jared White

        I said the people mentioned at the top are associated with feminism because they used to be a part of the mainstream movement.

        Warren was president of N.O.W.

        Erin Pizzey pretty much founded the (fair) DV industry until it was taken over by the bigoted feminists.

        Basically it was the same story with all of them. They were all for supporting women but when they dared to speak up for the rights of men they were scorned and had their feminist cards pulled by the mainstream movement.

        Now, except for Wendy I believe, they don’t consider themselves feminists.

        Christina created a new group I(independent)feminists to separate herself from bigots like Amanda Marcotte and Jessica Valenti. She is even working with Lionel Tiger in creating Male Studies.

        And Warren Farrell. Well we all know the Logic-bomb he dropped on the feminist hypocrisy machine.

        These people and a few others spoke out against the bigotry the feminist movement has displayed towards men, and now the mainstream feminist movement trashes them as anti-woman right wing-nuts and most young college women majoring in gender (women) studies who think they know all there is to know about feminism have never even heard of these people.

        Because the mainstream feminist movement lost all use for these people when they started caring about equality.

        This, I feel, is a major part of the reason why feminists who know their movement is full of bigoted shit won’t say anything about it publicly, offline, and on the news like Farrel, Pizzey, and Sommers did.

        They are cowards who remain silent and that is why they are worse than the bigots who actively seek to ruin the lives of men.

        Wow…almost wrote another blog post there.

  • LJ

    Excellent article! Well stated position. This argument is spot on with one rhetorical dissent.

    “That is, unless those who are among the gender with penises decide to make a group dedicated to male issues.”

    Gender is not sex, but you have intertwined them a few times in this article. I remember a time when I was asked what my sex was. Now I’m only asked what my gender is. I assert that the MRM should limit using gender identity in place of physical sex. If I’m not mistaken, feminists started this obfuscation.

    Maybe you used it to make a point. Either way I’m glad someone told it like it is. Keep up the fight.

    • http://counterfem.blogspot.com Fidelbogen

      “. . the MRM should limit using gender identity in place of physical sex. . .”

      Anybody who is against feminism should weed nearly every feminist word, phrase or concept out of their discourse altogether. That is, unless they mean to redefine it for purposes of subversion.

  • Atlas Reloaded

    Excellent article Jared. Now, just the first 10 seconds of this video is all you need but then again it is Motny Python…[youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qndx4ixMVW4&w=420&h=315

    • http://jmnzz.wordpress.com Jared White


  • Richard G.

    I have to admit. I have had a tough time debating Feminists. I haven’t been up to date with any MRA material lately, and I have this one bitch who is ripping me a new asshole.

    She is telling me that women have been oppressed for a very long time, and that America is one of the few countries where women are free.

    And that religion is oppressive towards women, and like every other piece of shit Feminist, she is quick to bring the status of Muslim women to the debate as some sort of sign that women are still oppressed, and that Feminism addresses the issues of women under Islam.

    I don’t know what to believe anymore. I have been really off track, and it seems that I forgot everything I knew. Maybe I need to come here as often as I used to.

    And sorry for derailing this thread and being off-topic, guys.

    • Jeremiah

      You might look at this, it’s not organized well, but it does provide plenty of information which when tied together shows women were never oppressed: http://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/kaef0/i_have_a_serious_question/c2ipj84

      • Richard G.

        Thanks. I need to refresh my memory, and indulge in informative material.

    • TheLeadedHeart

      Yeah, I had a bitch do that on my facebook wall for merely sharing a link to the main page of this website. She claimed to read everything here, then attacked me personally for supporting a group who claim that women are to blame for the inequalities of men and women in the legal and social structures of our country.

      Two female friends of mine who are anti-feminism joined me in telling her that women are anything but oppressed by anyone in the society, even going so far as to reveal times when they had (in their pasts) gotten away with horrible shit that no man could dream of getting away with.

      Like any and every feminist, the bitch didn’t care if those women had performed unspeakable acts of horror against the men they claimed to have loved, it was the man’s fault. Cheat on the man? “He wasn’t satisfying you.” Falsely accuse him of domestic violence because you were angry? “He shouldn’t have made you mad.” Slapped the shit out of him because he told you the truth like you asked him to? “He shouldn’t have told you that you looked fat in that dress.”

      It doesn’t matter what terrible a thing a woman does: A man made her do it. That’s all feminists truly care about; making men look like evil, terrorizing, antagonizing bastards who deserve it if you stab him in the genitals while he’s just simply watching Monday Night Football just because he didn’t buy you that shiny necklace you wanted just so that you could show it off at work for a week and then never wear it again.

      As many of the comments here have said: There are no good feminists. There never have been, and there never will be. The only thing that comes close to a ‘good’ feminist is a rational, logical thinking person who sees that, yes, there are some issues with women, and they do need to be stopped, but not at the expense of another person’s life. And those people are not feminists, my friends, those are “Anti-woman, rape supporters”.

      • Richard G.

        Women are either “brainwashed/manipulated/indoctrinated” by men, and men “deserve” it, or they are simply giving us men our just desserts for oppressing women for a gazillion years. The female mentality is shallow, primitive, and contradictory.

    • http://truthjusticeca.wordpress.com/ Denis

      Do a search on this site, here are two excellent resources about women’s “oppression”



      A cursory view of Islam/religion might lead one to believe that women are oppressed. Yet, there are strict social codes for both men and women. It may be unequal, but that doesn’t mean that only women are oppressed.

      • Richard G.

        It’s been awhile, but I need to get back in touch with the truth. Life tends to get in the way, but this is good source material to shut feminists up, or convince them about the errors of their ways, which in most cases is very unlikely.

        • TheLeadedHeart

          No, sadly they won’t even listen to this material. At least not in my experience. You know that condition of stupidity that you develop when you bury your face balls deep into a cause because you desperately need something to fill the void that your way of living has created? Yeah, those are the feminists I’ve run into. Then again, I kinda live in the backwoods, redneck central… so maybe it’s just a regional thing?

        • http://truthjusticeca.wordpress.com/ Denis

          It’s unlikely that you are ever going to convince a hardened feminist. IMO, it’s not even worth the effort. Uninformed men are are a much better target for education.

    • Stu

      Reply to these feminists who bring up the Islam card by telling them that they are religious bigots and Isamaphobs.

      When feminists do address Islam, which mostly they don’t because they are shit frightened of men that actually will fight back….they will waffle out some statistics about women being stoned to death etc. But this is like feminists stating that murder is a major cause of death for women in the workforce……it’s true…..but only because they are exempt from nearly every other cause of workplace death…….more men are murdered at work……but in only comprises a very small percentage of workplace deaths for men, because all the other causes of death are so huge.

      More men getting stoned to death in Islamic countries with sharia law then women……but as usual, feminists are only interested in displaying the female victims. They are the only ones that get the press…….because they are women……the men go to their deaths without anybody paying any attention or caring about it. And what should we expect…..our own countries have no problem with men making up the majority of every type of violent death……and sends men to die in the thousands in wars.

      Likewise….they will draw attention to FGM as the most horrible thing in the world…….all the while allowing and encouraging the continued practice routine circumcision of baby boys…….who can’t consent……..and…….laughing hysterically when women cut off a man’s whole penis and throw then in garbage disposals.

      No matter how women are treated……in any culture…..anywhere in the world……at anytime in history……men are treated worse……it’s just that some cultures actually demand accountability and responsibility of women at a fraction of the males level of accountability……..but even that is too much for feminists……..women must be completely free to do as they like…….totally……any amount of draconian laws can exist…..as long as women are not held to them.

      For example….the law is the same in Islam regarding adultery for men and women. If you are married and you have sex with another person…..the penalty is death by stoning……but it is seldom carried out nowadays. Gay sex between men is punishable by death………gay sex between women……married or not…..only gets 10 lashes for first offence……..increasing with each offence and can be death penalty after third offence. Unmarried people having sex……….with a married person or single person are given lashes…..but can be executed after a third offence. Men are whipped naked…….women are whipped fully clothed.

      A man legally must support his wife…..even if she has her own money or income. In return for this……a wife must provide her husband with sex…..and raise the children. But nothing says a woman must get married.

      You’ll hear plenty of rants about how women are accused of this and that and just put to death……..Taliban style……well……only the Taliban are like the Taliban…….oh…..and feminists are like them too actually. If you have a look at western culture, it has become more and more like a reverse Taliban legal system where men are the oppressed.

      Men can’t just accuse their wives of something and have them carted out of their homes and thrown in jail in Sharia law. VAWA is about as close as any system in world gets to being like the Taliban….and it’s getting worse every time it gets amended or renewed.

      Sexual harassment industry……..female Taliban.

      Western Family Law…….female Taliban.

      Rape Law…….female Taliban.

      It’s pretty easy to draw a lot of comparisons with the worst of the worst of Islamic legal systems…….and the feminist legal innovations that exist……and are being considered…..right here in the west.

      What about the UK seriously considering doing away with women’s prisons altogether……so matter what crime a woman commits….she won’t be going to jail. Show me a country or culture anywhere in the world…past or present where men could do anything….any crime…..and have no punishment.

      The muslims are fair and just compared to feminists. There is no greater sexism and totalitarianism then feminism anywhere in the world. And that will become more and more apparent as more and more of their demands are met

      • Richard G.

        The woman I was debating with exaggerated the instance where a woman was burned in the face with acid by a man whose marriage proposal she rejected. And she used this very argument to label Muslim men as evil and barbaric.

        I had to make a strong comeback and tell her that religion stresses the Gender Roles where the woman’s role is to be a mother and wife, while the man’s role was to MAINTAIN his family by being the “protector” and “provider”.

        That a woman was a man’s responsibility, and every transgression she made reflected on him solely. And to this day it still happens, because the thoughts of one (the man), are always the actions of two (the man and his wife).

        And I do agree that Feminism is much like the Taliban.

        • Stu

          In Sharia law, a woman’s testimony is worth half a man’s. In western law, a woman’s testimony is the law and a man’s is worth nothing

          • Stu

            Feminists are really digging themselves a grave because as shit as most western men see Islam, they will have to concede in the end, that it offers them a far better deal then feminism. I see the a lot of men supporting Islam in the future if feminism is not rolled back by other means.

          • Richard G.

            I think that the problem is that too many Westerners, especially Americans, are Islamophobic. They look at Muslims, and the first thing that comes into their minds is that these people are terrorists. I am a native New Yorker, so you can imagine how so many New Yorkers are paranoid.

            “See something, say something” is the slogan posted on subway billboards and MetroCards.

            Most Americans will never accept Islam, and they will do whatever they have to, to fight Islam. It’s been ingrained into our heads for the past ten years that Islam is the “Devil”, that Muslim women are oppressed, and that Muslim men are savages who beat women, and rape little boys and girls.

        • Stu

          Maybe American men will never support Islam Richard, but don’t make the mistake of thinking that America is the World. It’s a crumbling empire that is only held together via increasing debt and military force. If they don’t adopt something drastically different from the status quo, then they will be affectively extinct in a few more generations anyway. Population is now only maintained via immigration………that is people that are not american. Anyway, I believe most mens repulsion of Islam is purely because of the propaganda of the way it treats women…….right or wrong…….I think in the future there will be a lot less men who give a shit about that.

        • TheBlackKnight

          It’s funny that she would exaggerate that when, here in the US, a man’s penis gets cut off for wanting a divorce and it becomes a national joke! I guess violence is only bad when a woman is the victim.

          It’s funny, I’ve had my issues with some actions done in Islamic countries too but there are some surprising things coming from some of them that feminists never really bother to let people know.

          a) An Islamic country elected a female leader far before the US did (Benazir Bhutto of Pakistan)

          b) Iran legalizes sex changes and transexuals are legally accepted there. It’s not fully socially accepted but neither is it here. In terms of operations performed, they are second only to Thailand. (I was going to link the wikipedia page but no more of that shit!) http://documentaryheaven.com/transsexual-in-iran/

          Even taking into account all of their flaws, Islam advocates better rights and protections for both men and women than feminism ever did.

    • Raven01

      Muslim women are oppressed? How about the Muslim men that die for thier “honour”? I am no fan of any organized religion as they are too easily perverted to controlling ideologies. But, come on, Muslim women are protected with the very LIVES of Muslim men, that benefit comes with a cost. Her problem should be with Muslim women allowing men to die for them.

      Also, ask her, “exactly, what other countries are not oppressive?” This will stump her as I bet she is talking out of her ass and, only has the “party line” to fall back on. Her answers will give you opportunity to prove her wrong. And, that my friend will piss her off and rattle her.

  • Jeremiah

    Best article I’ve read recently. Bravo. You might consider expanding on how women were never oppressed, for the sake of the uninitiated. Some notes are available here: http://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/kaef0/i_have_a_serious_question/c2ipj84

  • TheBlackKnight

    “Good” feminists wouldn’t do nothing.

  • Atlas Reloaded

    I prefer “good” feminists DON’T do anything for us…at all.

  • Elder Swami

    Women were never oppressed, the idea is mostly based on the fact that they didn’t work in the old days, however I bet they didn’t want to work when the majority of jobs involved labour, long hours and danger. its only now that the west has transformed into a service economy that they have suddenly decided they should be working as well. What a load of crap!

    • Stu

      Yes, all one might have to do to destroy feminism is ban air conditioners in the work place…..maybe on environmental grounds or something. They do after all use a massive amount of electricity.

    • Bev

      Snippet for you about oppression of women in the middle ages. The punishment for women who committed adultry was a public parade with their hair shorn and possible banishment to a nunnery. The punishment for men could include up to public breaking on the wheel at the end of which their genitals were cut off and they were beheaded. An expert executioner could keep the victim alive until his head was cut off. Throw that one at the next feminist who talks about historical oppression.

      • Stu

        And one becomes an expert by doing the same thing many many times

    • FifthElemen7

      No, they weren’t allowed to work due to gender roles, with the exception of the poor. Women weren’t allowed to join the army hence they used to not die for the there country. I don’t support feminism but to say women were never oppressed is a lie.

      • http://www.avoiceformen.com Dr. F

        You say it’s a lie but don’t say why you think this.

        Even though you say it’s a lie, because it’s popular to say so, can you cite exactly how ?

      • Skeptic

        5th Element,
        If you’re talking about western history over the last few hundred years then I think saying women were historically oppressed is the real lie – http://angryharry.com/eswerewomenoppressedinthewest.htm

        If you’re going back further in time then I think you’re on even thinner ice.

  • http://charles-feminismthemisandristsruse.blogspot.com manfromman

    I do not and will not shrink two seconds of my time to listen or to read any article or blog written by any feminist (from any of the many feminism’s branches) including the so-called “good feminist”–with the [cautious] exception, of course, of the handfull you mentioned at the begining of your article.

    Any attempt they make to impress upon us that they are genuinely concerned with the many discrimination men are facing today because of feminism, is nothing but a false pretence which to me it signals just another of their many conniving contrivances that have at its core their self-serving interest and nothing more.

    There are good women and bad women, but there’s no such a thing as a “good feminist.” And if any apologist points out any group of such feminists, I still will not trust them even if they appear to be litterally dead.

    All those self-proclaimed “good feminists” have sedulously cultivated, or allowed, all form of discrimination, inequalities, and outright misandry against men and boys; so they aren’t [off the hook] in this evil violation under any pretence of inviduality or limited liability.

    “Silence–said once a wise man–is another form of conspiracy.” When you keep silence, or speak only to justify the wrong that’s been done, you have betrayed your own son, your father, your husband, your brother, your uncle, your nephew, and all of your male friends. So you aren’t only a “good feminist,” but not even a good woman.

    Nothing short of fearlessly, uncompromisingly, and unapologetically–in real life–challenging and confronting the perpetrators of this evil against men and boys will be the measure of a “good feminist.”

    • andybob

      I totally agree Mr Manfromman. There is no such thing as a ‘good feminist’.

      A popular claim women have made to me recently is:
      “Oh no, I’m not one of those feminists. I’m an ‘equalist’.”

      Thank you Debate God.

      Me: “So, you’re not a feminist?”
      Her: “I didn’t say…”
      Me: “You cannot be a feminist of any kind and pretend to care about equality because feminism is a hate movement which promotes and supports bigotry against men and boys. You can be a feminist or an equalist – not both”
      Her: “But…”
      Me: “Feminist bigotry? Let me count the ways…”

      These women look like frightened mice when cornered to denounce feminism. It’s as if the Matrix SS will cart them away should they defy the ststahood. Feminism’s for-us-or-against-us mentality artfully manipulates women’s natural herd instincts and equally natural lack of intellectual and moral integrity. Feminism is Marxism with tits. Stalin could have taken lessons.

      We are now at the point where women need to clarify where they stand. If it is anywhere under the Feminist Big Top, then we must treat them like the clowns they are (and I absolutely fucking hate clowns).

      This article is a timely reminder of the mindset we have to deal with and a heads up about a subtle but very telling change of tactics. Don’t be fooled.

      • http://charles-feminismthemisandristsruse.blogspot.com manfromman

        Thanks, andybob, for your reply.

        You’re absolutely correct in every point you’ve made.

        “Feminism’s for-us-or-against-us mentality artfully manipulates women’s natural insticnts…”

        That’s precisely what’s going on. Feminists don’t take well to criticism and they certainly are intolerant to defection. Male critics are deemed “sexists” and female critics and defectors as “traitors.” When any movement, regardless of the cause the claim they stand for, have to resort to this kind of conniving, we can be absolutely certain that there’s nothing good or noble about their “cause.”

  • Free Human Being

    MRA’s and Feminuts can not share the same space. This is an us versus them war because they are firing tanks at us and we are firing bullets.

    It is a numbers game; being that eventually we will invade their tanks and outnumber and out rank their forces.

    This is a war on boys and men and it’s the most insidious collaboration of misinformation in the history of mankind. MRA’s need to invade every neutral space and make our voices heard with logic and proof.

    Fubar their shit up

    • http://charles-feminismthemisandristsruse.blogspot.com manfromman


      • Atlas Reloaded

        “But it does not have to be a ZERO SUM GAME!” Jeezuzfucknuts Ihate when the Good Men say that!

        Yeah-it does in fact.

        • http://charles-feminismthemisandristsruse.blogspot.com manfromman

          Sorry, Atlas Reloaded, but I’m not sure I understand your quotation above in your reply to me. I’m not so sure it has anything to do with what I’ve said. Does it?

          • Atlas Reloaded

            No but I meant to respond more to Free Human. I was agreeing with what he said but also reading the rest of Matlack’s article about albinos blah blah blah. There he said what they always say about “zero sum war.”

            I am finding it very difficult lately to adapt Fidelbogen’s way of rhetorical discipline.

    • Stu

      Logic and proof alone will not do it. Feminists don’t even believe their own bullshit, how could they when they know they made it up.

      You need logic, proof, and fear.

      That’s why I’d like to hear all the MGTOW, Grass Eaters, Free Range Men, or whatever else you want to call them……..respond to questions about why they have chosen their path by saying…….it is the laws…….feminist laws….and we ain’t doing shit you want until they are gone.

      When people begin to point out that you will collapse society like that………just say……..good.

    • Raven01

      Doing that in not so free spaces.
      My real name is Jason, and like the greek namesake I heal faster than feminist slings and arrows can inflict injury.
      I swear if I see that book on anyone’s coffee table I will lose a friend or acquaintance that day because, I will piss on that publication.

  • JinnBottle

    Just now went to checkout one of the “moderate feminist” *blogs* via Mr White’s link. It was called “No Seriously, What About teh Menz [sic]”. Couldn’t even get past the first few paragraphs of their self-defined “seminal” article. It was one of those honey & ketchup sandwich type pieces that are so common in women’s writing: no sense looking for the “core” of the matter, since there isn’t one – or for that matter, a sentence that contains any consistent, discoverable evidence of substantial thinking whatsoever. I couldn’t even tell if the author was indeed male or female. And, as I say, by two to three paras in, I didn’t care enough to even findout.

  • JinnBottle

    …And just now had a look at the “moderate feminist” *article* Jared linked us to – on “10 Scenarios of False Rape Accusations” – juxtaposing a hypothetical “Bob” vs “Alice” in 10 possible scenarios that certain people – (rape supporting pigs, to be specific) – might call “false rape accusations”. Again, didn’t have to read long to see that the author comes down squarely and consistently on the side of Alice. Myself, I have only two criteria, derived from way, wa-ay back, when the world was sane: There *has* to have been *force, or the threat of force* on Bob’s part: and Alice, for hers, has to prove it. Period.

  • Zuberi

    There is no such thing as a good feminist and there won’t ever be a common ground between MRM and feminists. You can’t find common ground with a group of childish ingrates who lie, cheat and steal from you.

    • Hayden Hanna

      I am not comfortable with just giving one up vote to this comment. Some guys will bend over backwards and twist themselves into a pretzel to avoid this bit of truth.

  • keyster

    Feminism is one big seriously organized and very well financed hen house, with a few cuckholded roosters keeping vigil out in the yard.

    • andybob

      Good one Mr Keyster!
      I hope you don’t mind me using this to annoy some feminists (oops, I mean ‘equalists’) in future.

    • http://www.manwomanmyth.com Perseus

      Very nice.

      Feminism is aristocrat welfare.

  • ForsakenEagle

    A “good feminist” will claim to stand by men’s rights to the extent of protecting their own special privileges. Then this same “good feminist” will stand silent when a so-called radical commits a dastardly act, such as cutting off a man’s penis without anesthesia and throwing it into a trash compactor. When men start to denounce the evil act for what it is, the “good feminist” will try to redirect anger away from feminism and, by extension, herself. It all sums up to feminists looking after feminism, not men’s rights.

    Great post, Jared!

  • Paul Elam

    They. Were. Never. Oppressed.

    • http://charles-feminismthemisandristsruse.blogspot.com manfromman

      Owesome video, Mr. Elam. Right on point. I would like, with your consent, to post it on my blog. I’ll be waiting for your “yes” or “no” response. Thank you much.

      • TheLeadedHeart

        I hope I’m not wrong in speaking for Mr. Elam when I say that I don’t believe he’ll mind even the slightest bit, as he’s always shown joy when he sees that the word has been spread, if only a little bit further.

        • http://charles-feminismthemisandristsruse.blogspot.com manfromman

          Thanks, TheLeadedHeart. I, too, thought he wouldn’t mind. I just wanted to be sure I’m not committing an infringement. Thanks again.

      • Paul Elam

        Post away!

    • Lucian Cross

      This video-essay still impresses me and I’ve viewed and shared it with others many times.
      In fact I use it when talking with the ‘oppressed’. I ask if they can, within the context established by the video, objectively refute even one observation and stance from it I’ll blindly agree with everything every feminist has, is, and will say.
      Most often it leads to their stammering, ad hominems targeting the presenter, shaming tactics, and herrings of so many colors Crayola could take a lesson or two. It also leads to their crying… seriously… because they eventually realize two things:
      1) I will not knowingly buy into a lie; and
      2) They have invested the value of their life into one.

      It is a testament to Paul’s critical and disciplined mind that I have not been forced into intellectual and social slavery.

      Love you Paul!

  • kiwihelen

    Hi there,

    Were women ever “oppressed?”

    We were along with men who were without property – because back in the time when women were fighting for legal emancipation, men who did not own property also did not have the same legal rights as land owning men.

    We were when we could not legally enter into the opportunities for education in the same way as our male counterparts did, but those in the laboring class in Victorian society also lacked those opportunities.

    We were when we were a voice unheard in politics but so were both genders of colour and the GLBT community.

    We’ve got the rights, now we have to step up and take responsibility. All rights have consequences.

    If I want to vote, I need to be informed.
    If I want to be educated I have to use that education to support myself.
    If I want to be a political voice, I have to speak out.

    Ignorance is not an excuse, childbirth is a feminine task, but child raising is something that both parents (and a whole community) is best fitted to do, and being “the weaker sex” does not give me a get-out of jail free card when I am silent about injustice.

    • http://www.manwomanmyth.com Perseus

      “We were along with men who were without property”- nice try, CONFLATION. Men and females may not have possessed a specific privilege or right such as owning land, but that does not equal o-p-p-r-e-s-s-i-o-n. At every point in history, females were protected and sheltered from the worst of life, by MEN.

      “We were when we could not legally enter into the opportunities for education in the same way as our male counterparts did, but those in the laboring class in Victorian society also lacked those opportunities.” – Lie. Upper class females did receive education; parents and society sometimes chose not to invest in education for females because, as a matter of BIOLOGY and MANY OTHER PRACTICAL HISTORICAL NATURAL reasons, the return on investment was not favorable, and still often isn’t, as a matter of fact, not of misogyny. Higher education is often used as finishing schools by females to catch a ‘good’ husband, choosing to raise children instead of applying their education to a career. Again, facts are facts, and their is nothing misogynistic about facts.

      Furthermore, while females did not frequent education as much, they also didn’t frequent war, death, dangerous brutal and deadly jobs AT ALL. They did not bear the burdens of expectations and demands to protect and provide for a family. A fucking TRADEOFF- do you understand that word? And a hell of a good deal on your end at that, just ask Schlafly. Yet you and your associates would try to have us believe that such a TRADEOFF/BALANCE/DIVISION of LABOR equals oppression- oppression of the collective group “females” by the collective group “males”. The very same males who fought and died that she didn’t have to. The “oppressive males” who so sheltered and protected her that they experienced a shorter lifespan than her. By what fucking definition of oppression do you arrive at a scenario where the “oppressed” lives a longer, healthier, more privileged, safer, protected and higher quality of life than the “oppressors”? It’s all I can do here to restrain and not throw in a, “sweet tart, you are so high.” Oh shit, did I say that out loud?

      “If I want to vote, I need to be [conscripted].”
      “If I want to vote, I need to [sacrifice].”
      “If I want to vote, I need to [fight and die in front line battle].”

      Classic female sheltered entitlement perspective:
      “If I want to vote, I have to sit and type a few words in a comfy air conditioned, ergonomic office.”

      Two cornerstones of feminist/misandrist evil: double-speak and half-speak, both are FUCKING LIES.

    • http://www.manwomanmyth.com Perseus

      “We were along with men who were without property”- nice try, CONFLATION. Men and females may not have possessed a specific privilege or right such as owning land, but that does not equal o-p-p-r-e-s-s-i-o-n. At every point in history, females were protected and sheltered from the worst of life, by MEN.

      “We were when we could not legally enter into the opportunities for education in the same way as our male counterparts did, but those in the laboring class in Victorian society also lacked those opportunities.” – Half-speak. Upper class females did receive education; parents and society sometimes chose not to invest in education for females because, as a matter of BIOLOGY and MANY OTHER PRACTICAL HISTORICAL NATURAL reasons, the return on investment was not favorable, and still often isn’t, as a matter of fact, not misogyny. Higher education is often used as finishing schools by females to catch a ‘good’ husband, choosing to raise children instead of applying their education to a career. Again, facts are facts, and there is nothing misogynistic about facts.

      Furthermore, while females did not frequent education as much, they also didn’t frequent war, death, dangerous brutal and deadly jobs AT ALL. They did not bear the burdens of expectations and demands to protect and provide for a family. A TRADEOFF- do you understand that word? And a hell of a good deal on your end at that, just ask Schlafly. Yet you and your associates would try to have us believe that such a TRADEOFF/BALANCE/DIVISION of LABOR equals oppression- oppression of the collective group “females” by the collective group “males”. The very same males who fought and died that she didn’t have to. The “oppressive males” who so sheltered and protected her that they experienced shorter lifespans than her. By what ludicrous definition of oppression do you arrive at a scenario where the “oppressed” live longer, healthier, more privileged, pampered, safer, protected and higher quality lives than the “oppressors”?

      “If I want to vote, I need to be [conscripted].”
      “If I want to vote, I need to [sacrifice].”
      “If I want to vote, I need to [bear equal responsibility].”

      • andybob

        Unleash the Krakon, Mr Perseus.

        Kiwihelen is failing to comprehend that while many opportunities were denied to women, they were also denied to the vast majority of men. The distorted lens of feminist-controlled perspective has resulted in some very quaint notions regarding history. Looming large among these is the idea that men’s lives have been an endless smorgasbord of privilege and choice, whilst women have been ‘oppressed’ and sidelined.

        This distortion of the truth has served feminists well. Placing the ‘yoke of guilt’ around the necks of men cleverly manipulates our instincts to protect women as well as our sense of justice. This is what creates obedient white knights. It has also blinded the majority of men to the fact that our lives have been an endless litany of suffering, servitude, sacrifice and exploitation. Men’s reality has never been enviable.

        Digesting the red pill means rejecting the feminist narrative of our history and embracing the truth as laid out by Mr Perseus. I would like to compel Kiwihelen, who is well-intentioned (and an activist), to see the whole picture – this means viewing history from a male perspective and not the victim soundbites of a women’s studies sobfest.

    • Hayden Hanna

      I want to address one statement you make because I do not believe that it is accurate and perpetuates a myth. You said women were never a voice until they had a right to vote. Married women always influenced and still do influence the votes of their husbands. Women did not “win” the right to vote. Enough men loved and cared about women who wanted to vote that women eventually gained that right. America has been slowly paying the price for the mistake of allowing women to vote since it occurred. I doubt I will live to see my country admit the mistake and correct it. I also doubt that I will live to see women admit and fight to register with the Selective Service the way I did before being allowed to vote.

      • Raven01

        If only our predessors had the forethought to require selective service registry (and the potential for frontlines fire-fights) to the right to vote……. They claimed the wanted “equality”,, well that would leave no room to say they were not equal. If they are willing to pay the same price as men they get the same rights, otherwise quit bitching.

  • http://none universe

    These are the names of people who are among a very small minority of individuals (associated with feminism) that truly care about the discrimination both men and women face within western societies.

    – (above parenthesis mine)
    Eliminate the concept behind those three parenthesized words from the opening sentense of this finely worded article and humanity would somewhat be this way all along.
    But no, instead, and relative to the greater populace, another minority of individuals vehemently, illegitimately and uncompromisingly wave a one sex grievance banner forging a disruptive division of the sexes. As a result both halves of one complete whole compromised, no less. Madness.

    This madness populated by many surface drones of and led by a greater inner hive who’ve both managed to trump up and over-magnify a manufactured one sex only litany of resultingly baseless concerns. Of one sex over the other. For one half of the whole, of one sex over the other, with fraudulent claims to a constantly shifting false standard imagined as being parity to the other sex. Sheer madness.

    As for the “good” feminists who claim to be for complete ‘equality’ between the sexes. They appear to end up preaching a similar shifting message their varied other sisters do – female only social advocasy.

    It may not seem like it but the end is coming for this fraudulent social equality movement that distinguished itself as being more a double-talk female centered social ameliorization program. Their proponents have paid lip-service to their alleged original goal while undeservingly helping only themselves financially through and off the backs of men.
    As per examples stated above, for here on in, a continuation of such would be predictable madness. Something the fathers of antiquity warned us about, perhaps?
    Drop the exclusive one sex advocasy while talking parity.
    And let’s fully discover the forces whose promotion of such social meddling created embedded and long lasting disruptive animocities.

  • Eincrou

    “Were women ever “oppressed?”
    We were…..x3″

    You have recited the history every westerner is indoctrinated in with admirable accuracy, but even if lies like it being illegal for women to become educated were true, none of what you listed is oppression. If you want to know what oppression of humanity is, look to North Korea.

    Honesty demands that you look at the entire picture, rather than abusing the age-old feminist trick of listing and exaggerating the ways in which females are disadvantaged or inconvenienced, while making sure to never mention the ways in which males are disadvantaged as a counter balance. This is important to do, because the burdens males have borne have always put those of women to shame.

    Women didn’t need educations because men were their workhorses, and even today after the feminist revolution, women still aren’t educated as to how the world actually works, and men are still doing 90%+ of productive work in the economy. Women have some fancy (and outrageously expensive) degrees, though. I’ll give them that.

    Further, the economies of the past 6,000 years were unable to bear the weight of millions upon millions of women getting worthless degrees and having phony professional careers; all ultimately possible because of the men who actually have to toil and sweat productively to make this harsh planet comfortable enough for women.

    We are nearing the end of this very short, aberrant period in which Western civilization devotes the vast majority of its resources toward pretending women and “both genders of colour” are more valuable, more intelligent, more productive, and more moral than they really are.

    MRAs are fighting tooth and nail to ensure that this transition occurs as a result of deliberate action to resolve the injustices and imbalances, rather than a devastating decline in the level of civilization that will take hundreds of years to recover from. Yes, the trends MRAs have identified could really lead to that kind of worst-case scenario.

    If they succeed, women of the future will be treated fairly. It may not live up to the standard of absolute equality of outcomes that feminists have taught us to idealize, but individual women who are willing to ‘man up’ will be able to vote, compete fairly with men in the economy and job market, and everything else you can imagine.

    If they fail, however, that is ironically the worst outcome for women of the West. Tyranny will descend upon men and women. Nobody will have that sacred “right” that gives human life all of its meaning: voting for scumbag politicians.

    I don’t think you realize how serious this is, kiwihelen. It’s not a matter of us just patiently waiting 300 years for women to eventually decide to follow your three-point plan. They never will. Feminism and misandry are civilizational death sentences, and the disease must be excised immediately.

  • Adam

    OT, but I saw a documentary today about global structural engineering.
    In it, it detailed the Golden Gate bridge among others, and that it was the first project to enforce safety lines, hard hats, nets and all that jazz. The nets saved 11 men’s lives.

    9 men still died. I doubt that their families were compensated with the loss at the time, hah! What an idea putting a price on a human.
    However I also doubt there’s a plaque or similar honouring the men who worked on this bridge.

    Still there are complaints that men oppressed women. I would be that more than a few women have benefited from men’s deaths – from the utility of this bridge alone.

    There is no greater sacrifice any human can give than the termination of their existence.
    Words cannot express the rage I feel.

  • Eye in the Sky

    There are no “good” feminists, just like there are no good Nazis. The Nazis were a collection of bullies, perverts, and sadists – the feminazis are cut from the same cloth.

    Make no mistake, we are engaged in a war in our own homes, schools, workplaces and public spaces. The first casualty of war is truth, and the feminists are practiced liars.

    I work with young women – they are all thoroughly indoctrinated in feminist ideology from their earliest years in school.

    Reason and logic have no meaning to fanatics, and make no mistake, feminists are true believers. No statistics or examples will change their minds when everything in the media and society reinforces their hateful propaganda.

    Like the “good” Germans, women remained silent when they benefited from stealing men’s rights, men’s property, and men’s freedom. The only way to kill feminism is to penalize every feminist crime. Register-Her.com is a giant leap in that direction.

  • http://alcuin-constant.blogspot.com/ Alcuin

    Reading articles such as this gives me hope that feminism can indeed be defeated. Your article is vastly superior to 99% of the claptrap produced in the academic field. Keep writing!

  • Lucian Cross

    The simplest indicator proving whether or not their are good -note the lack of quotations- feminists in today’s society is found, not exhaustively, in the following:

    .When as self identified feminists they openly criticize female behavior which is harmful to society
    .Whenever they rally as self identified feminists DEMANDING equal treatment under the law
    .When they actively, on behalf of equality, speak out against gender myths
    .When they acknowledge pain and victimhood are not uniquely female experiences
    .When the understand how the choice of inaction can be quite destructive

    That’s all I got…

  • kiwihelen

    “Women didn’t need educations because men were their workhorses, and even today after the feminist revolution, women still aren’t educated as to how the world actually works, and men are still doing 90%+ of productive work in the economy. Women have some fancy (and outrageously expensive) degrees, though. I’ll give them that.”

    Rather than trying to answer your whole post in one hit, I would like to focus on this section initially.

    Education for women in the Victorian era was one of the few ways a woman could have the choice of being able to be financially independent from their fathers and to be allowed the choice as to whether they entered a contract of marriage. Would you say that wishing to avoid financial dependence was a bad thing?

    Second,your figure of 90% of productive work is interesting to me – how are you defining productive work? Is this where a physical end product is created?

    For example, am I as a health care professional a “non-productive worker” because I don’t produce anything physical? Or is my work productive because one of my care objectives for a patient (regardless of gender) is to make return to work physically possible.

    If I am interpreting this right (and forgive me if I am wrong), then looking back at the time when women were fighting oppression (IMHO, modern western women are no longer oppressed) their productive labour has to include the risky activity of childbirth…so I am not sure I can agree that the men were the “workhorses”.

    Now, I would agree that there is huge ignorance, fostered by the third wave feminists who have succeeded in reinforcing the idea of “woman as victim.”

    I am sure my female ancestors would view BS of the modern feminists with as much contempt as the MRA.

    For the record, I bought another bra after I burnt mine – so I guess I am not a feminist 😉

    • Richard G.

      Can you stop using the word “oppression”? You make it seem as if men tortured women in the past, and held them against their will.

      Women may have been discriminated in the past on certain levels, but Paternalistic concepts like chivalry and male protectionism kept women out of harms way, and exalted them to a level higher than men. All on account of being “precious” and “defenseless”, and being the ones to give birth to the next generation.

      Men in the past had this notion that women needed to be “protected” and “provided” for, even to the point where women were restricted. Sort of like a how a father is overprotective of his daughter. You call this Paternalism.

      And to this day, the thoughts of one (the man), are always the actions of two (the man and his wife). So women are given less culpability on par with crimes that they equally commit with men.

    • scatmaster

      Education for women in the Victorian era was one of the few ways a woman could have the choice of being able to be financially independent from their fathers and to be allowed the choice as to whether they entered a contract of marriage. Would you say that wishing to avoid financial dependence was a bad thing?

      In the Victorian era they were the first off the boat.

      Now excuse me while I go waste my time (as some MRA’s would subscribe to the theory) watching a hockey game. Back in a few hours.

    • Eincrou

      “Education for women in the Victorian era was one of the few ways a woman could have the choice of being able to be financially independent from their fathers and to be allowed the choice as to whether they entered a contract of marriage. “

      An education allowed 19th century women to do what, exactly? In those times, there was very little government interference in the economy to artificially create jobs for women or to force employers to hire women who would not bring benefit to the operation at least equal to their salaries.

      There were almost no office jobs, and the economy was mostly agrarian. In those times, a comprehensive education would have been a waste of resources for most men and women, since farming was the primary function of the economy.

      It’s very appropriate that you tell us you’re a health care professional, because education and health care are the two biggest and most inefficient government-sponsored female jobs programs in existence.

      Medical, education, and government spending rise far faster than inflation because these have been tasked with absorbing the majority of the millions of women looking to have phony professional careers.

      You didn’t fully describe your job, but it sounds like one of the many ancillary jobs that have sprung up around health care as a plausible reason to employ women. It doesn’t seem to be involved with directly providing medical treatment; i.e. the work doctors, nurses, and technical technicians do.

      These types of jobs do not provide nearly as much value to patients as the direct treatment, and if we had a proper free-market in health care where customers pay the entire cost of their treatments, many patients would decline to avail themselves of your services to save money. It is an artificial distortion that people are forced to support your salary through outrageously high costs, even if they never see you.

      “[…] their productive labour has to include the risky activity of childbirth…so I am not sure I can agree that the men were the “workhorses”.”

      So you believe that propagating the species (an act every species of female animal, plant, and insect is naturally and effortlessly endowed with the ability to perform) counts as the same amount of labor as creating new technologies, building bridges, fighting crime, etc. Gestating children does, of course, count as productive labor, but I believe you vastly overestimate the productive output of your uterus.

      Even so, women in the West are failing to be productive enough in this area to keep their native populations stable. If they did this, is would be far better than perpetuating the massive drain on society of the education, health care and public sectors. As it is, many women forgo childbearing to instead build a career in these bloated and inefficient areas.

  • Richard G.

    Just read the comments section of this video. I just go into shock, because I have no way of debating this Feminist. The lies that this chick posts are mind-boggling, and this is why I am no longer attracted to women.

    Feminism has made too many women lame, stupid, weak, and egotistical.

    • Richard G.

      This is my last take on this subject, and it’s time to move on to the next. I just wanted to show all of you the mind-numbing stupidity of so many Feminists.

    • http://www.manwomanmyth.com Perseus

      Great video and he is exactly right that chivalry is as much an enemy of men as feminism. Chivalry is the mental pathology of bigotry that causes male judges and legislatures to brutalize men for the favor of females. Chivalry and feminism are mutually enabling and reinforcing pathologies which have no other possible outcome than unchecked misandry and annihilation of males.

      It’s an interesting irony regarding the “domestic violence” theater that we live under. The reality is that collectively, on the whole, men as a group are the abused in an abusive relationship with females as a group. Females as a group are the aggressors and males are the whipped, enabling and broken victims of collective female aggression and violence. Blue pill men have a terrible case of Stockholm Syndrome in relation to females.

    • TheBlackKnight

      In my opinion chivalry=feminism; it is the primary cause.

      The entitlement mentality and victim mentality of women would not have existed if men didn’t treat them as if having a vagina marked the pinnacle of human evolution. Men set the stage for this and hopefully we’re learning from it.

      NO good deed goes unpunished…

      • http://www.manwomanmyth.com Perseus

        Well received and affirmed, BlackKnight.

        Feminism = Misandry
        Chivalry = Misandry
        Feminism + Chivalry = Misandry on Steroids

  • AdVader

    it started with the pill, the making of antisocial destructive borderliners-sociopaths, femini$$m-samesex-atheism are about nothing more than pseudological lies, there still are good women though good fembots don’t exist alike being gay doesn’t exist and no one knows if god exists or not.

  • B.R. Merrick

    Wow. Not sure how I misssed this one. Succinct and superb. One of the best (and, for me, most important) articles posted to this site.

    • http://jmnzz.wordpress.com Jared White

      Thanks. I feel like I should say more but thanks is the only thing I can think of.

      So thanks! 😀

  • http://www.avoiceformen.com/activism-page/karma/ KARMA MRA MGTOW

    Your drawing a long bow there dude.

    Plenty of Atheists, my self and Paul Elam are MRA’s.
    Tom Leykis and Richard Dawkins are allover the web
    speaking out against feminism also.

    If you want to fuckup the MRM, religion will do it every time.

    We must destroy feminism, you really think the feminists give a shit about my religious beliefs or lack of?

    I suspect the personality traits you mention existed in the human race before the pill was invented.

    • http://www.avoiceformen.com Dr. F

      You’re right Karma.

      Chuck into the discussion any one of these:
      Gun control,
      Global warming,
      Capital punishment,
      Rational economics or
      Religion and you divide. Period.

      I, like most here, have strong views on some or all of these but to bring them here is myopic at best.

      We’ve seen time and time again these issues slapped down on the table and you know what happens every single time ?

      We debate and discuss and swear at each other and the very reason we congregate for a better world for our kids, brothers and sisters becomes dissolved into a painter’s palette of grey muck.

      We all lose and we are all “right” in our argument.

      Luke Skywalker blew up the Death Star because he stayed on target, and he’d have stuffed it up if there was a flea in his ear niggling at him to pause and debate something else.

      Silly film analogy, but then again you know secretly I have a point here eh ?

  • Otter

    The female “groupthink” is a terrifying thing to behold. It’s like we are facing a hive of bees bent on our destruction and we are each a solitary mantis banded together by necessity.

    • Dennis

      What feminists call “ways of knowing” is truly mindless group-think; and is an especially hateful endeavor at that. We men weren’t always, as you put it, “solitary mantis” beings. Feminists destroyed most of the fraternal organizations and clubs that they insisted “oppressed women by putting them at an economic disadvantage” and white knights, in their endless efforts to please and satisfy every whim feminists might have, made many male only clubs and organizations illegal. That and the resultant misandrist shaming of men in our sick society destroyed much of the fraternal bond we men had.

      We need to restore the bond of fraternal respect, fidelity and trust that men once had between one another. I think AVFM presents a great opportunity to begin restoring that bond.

  • OnlyAMan

    The point made that “women have never been oppressed” is basic to the whole discussion. To oppress means to overwhelm and smother (as in oppressive heat). Women who have had talent and have worked hard have succeeded in any field they chose. (They rarely chose logging or mining.) Instead, women have been elevated (the opposite of pressing down), idealized, and protected–by men. All of the complaints registered since the suffragette movement have been answered in the affirmative–by men. All of the measures (birth control, the most important) that have given women unbelievable freedom of options have been invented and provided by men. There has rarely been misogyny. Most men have liked women and still do. There now is misandry by a vocal minority of mostly lesbian women and a cohort of self-hating men. This is the open expression of what has from the start made men the disadvantaged sex (conscription, work in the most dangerous jobs). At a certain point after World War Two in the wake of a period of prosperity in the United States these women began to attack and disparage men openly. One could call this ingratitude. But it is now contempt for men (misandry). The probable counterforce is that most women do like men and will soon begin to speak out against the haters, the sisterhood. But then there are the qualities of the modern woman Esther Vilar wrote about that may dominate. See THE MANIPULATED MAN. It may be that the man-haters are encouraging the expression of those qualities in women. That would be the worst outcome imaginable. In the meantime, conditions worsen for boys and young men.