Swastika

A lesson from history

They say that those who forget History are doomed to repeat it. I’m firmly convinced that this is so, which is why I don’t accept the stance of people who wish to dismiss arguments based on how ‘wacky’ they sound. In my estimation, people like that aren’t worth the time it takes to respond.

But there comes a point where merely mentioning certain things becomes laughable, any approach to certain subject matter automatically rendered crazy and completely unacceptable. Usually, those arguments are the most uncomfortable ones. And we all know what that usually means.

I have made the argument in the past that Nazism and Feminism share more than a passing resemblance, but it really goes far deeper than that. Our society resembles the pre-war conditions quite a bit too. To get where I’m coming from, I intend to bore the hell out of you with a history lesson. Ain’t that grand?

Hitler was a big believer in Natural Selection, and would deliberately set up conflicting departments, and have them fight things out. 
The end of the First World War baffled the German soldiers, who were on enemy territory literally everywhere along the front (ie, they were winning), and rather than accept the death of millions of those back home via flu and starvation as the cause of their loss, they blamed Jews and Marxists.

The widespread hunger and disease that immediately followed WW1 led to a polarization of politics, and all sides became radical in the face of crisis. A Marxist revolt in Munich led to the death of more than 500, with the brutal suppression of Marxists by Right-Wing extremists.

Nearly all of the leaders of this Marxist uprising were Jewish, and Jews were considered synonymous with Marxist. They were held up as scapegoats for all of the ills facing post-war Germany; the starvation, the unemployment, the economic collapse.

In 1921, the Nazi party is established, with member 55 (55th member), a certain Adolf Hitler at the helm. Many famous Germans join the Nazi Party, more for the rush of the Revolutionary spirit than for ideological reasons. The Nazi party line, that there was an International Jewish Conspiracy to dominate the world, was firmly established and openly preached.

Meanwhile, French troops alienated Germans in occupied territories, with oppressive laws and often brutal treatment. The collection of reparations monies sparked a political march by many of the right wing parties in Germany, at Hitlers urging. This became known as The Putsch, and led to Hitler’s imprisonment for one month, where he wrote Mein Kampf.

In the mid 1920’s, the Weimar Republic (Democratic Germany) began to finance their reparations payments by borrowing from the USA, rather than economy-destroying levels of taxation on its struggling citizens. In short, Germany deficit-financed its way to economic health in what the Nazis referred to as the Weimar Decadence. Berlin is considered the cultural center of Europe during this time, a hotbed of Art, Music, Design and Architecture

Paramilitary groups were in vogue as well, and political parties routinely had a security wing. The Nazis formed theirs, and called them the SA, or Brownshirts, in and around this time.

1928 election, the Nazis get 2.6% of the popular vote.

Then, agricultural prices drop through the floor, causing widespread poverty in the countryside, and the beginnings of more mass starvation. The Stock Market Crash of 1929 has the USA call in their loans to Germany, and unemployment and inflation skyrocket. The suffering spreads to the middle class, and tent cities and soup kitchens abound.

1930 election, the Nazi party, still saying the same things, gets 26% of the vote. More and more people were willing to listen to them, as a result of a more extremist public. Hitler positioned himself as economic savior, at the head of a dynamic party that would destroy Germany’s internal enemies and rebuild the country around National unity. And people liked his message.

The Nazi Party campaign platform was more or less as follows:

  • National Unity.
  • Equal Rights for citizens.
  • The powers of citizenship should only be for those of German blood.
  • The expulsion of foreign nationals in the case of the existence of unemployment for German citizens.
  • The abolition of all income obtained without labor or effort.
  • Profit-sharing in large enterprises, the large-scale development of old-age pension, and the creation and maintenance of a sound middle class.
  • Land reform in accordance with national needs and a law for expropriation without compensation of land for public purposes. Abolition of ground rent and prevention of all speculation in land.
  • Ruthless battle against those who harm the common good by their activities.
  • The courses of study at all educational institutions to be adjusted to meet the requirements of practical life. Understanding of the concept of the State must be achieved through the schools (teaching of civics) at the earliest age at which it can be grasped. We demand the education at the public expense of specially gifted children of poor parents, without regard to the latter’s position or occupation.
  • The State must raise the level of national health by means of mother-and-child care, the banning of juvenile labor, achievement of physical fitness through legislation for compulsory gymnastics and sports, and maximum support for all organizations providing physical training for young people.
  • Laws to fight against deliberate political lies and their dissemination by the press.
  • To carry out all the above we demand: the creation of a strong central autority in the Reich. Unquestioned authority by the political central Parliament over the entire Reich and over its organizations in general. The establishment of trade and professional organizations to enforce the Reich basic laws in the individual states.

The Party leadership promises to take an uncompromising stand, at the cost of their own lives if need be, on the enforcement of the above points. Oh yeah, and everything bad is The Jews’ fault.

Munich, February 24, 1920.

The 1932 elections did not gain Hitler power, but he established himself as a credible statesman in the eyes of the glitterati. In fact, it was backroom dealings by the ultra rich and powerful that got Hitler the Chancellorship, not an open election. That said, the Nazi party was clearly a frontrunner for the next election. They certainly had rich and powerful (and American) friends.

By 1933, political opponents were being incarcerated in ‘concentration camps’ like Dachau, though most served a year long sentence then were released. There were widespread accusations, and threats of ‘protective custody’ abounded. Fear of the Gestapo, or more likely being reported to the Gestapo by their neighbor, kept political dissent from formalizing, and kept the population paralyzed with fear…of each other. The Gestapo itself did not have the manpower to do much other than process the paperwork.

Jews were openly harassed and attacked, blamed for societies ills. Nazi propaganda highlighted Jewish participation in certain occupations as “privileged” and suspicious without ever mentioning that Jews were actually restricted to these occupations by law.

The Nazi Party ended unemployment via public spending, and Public Works projects like the Autobahn. These improvements were restricted to True Germans however, and Jews were excluded more and more from public life. The Government instituted retaliatory discrimination against Jews.

The Nazi party itself, and the Government it formed, was a wildly disorganized mess. Hitler was a big believer in Natural Selection, and would deliberately set up conflicting departments, and have them fight things out. Nazi party chapters were led by those who took power, not those who asked for it. Government departments spent most of their time fighting each other.

Hitler was surrounded by “yes men,” who he would ramble on to about his vision. These men would then attempt to outdo their rivals in pleasing Der Fuhrer. This led to a quick escalation in brutality. Public beatings, book burnings, robberies and home invasions were commonly carried out against the Jews to no public outcry. The most famous of these incidents is known as Krystalnacht from all the broken glass on the sidewalks.

In order to ‘prevent suffering’, the Nazis began a program of Euthanasia:

The so-called “Euthanasia” program was National Socialist Germany’s first program of mass murder, predating the genocide of European Jewry which we call the Holocaust by approximately two years. The effort represented one of many radical eugenic measures which aimed to restore the racial “integrity” of the German nation. It endeavored to eliminate what eugenicists and their supporters considered life unworthy of life. Those individuals who they believed, because of severe psychiatric, neurological, or physical disabilities represented at once a genetic and a financial burden upon German society and the state.

CHILD EUTHANASIA PROGRAM

In the spring and summer months of 1939, a number of planners–led by Philipp Bouhler, the director of Hitler’s private chancellery, and Karl Brandt, Hitler’s attending physician–began to organize a secret killing operation targeting disabled children. On August 18, 1939, the Reich Ministry of the Interior circulated a decree compelling all physicians, nurses, and midwives to report newborn infants and children under the age of three who showed signs of severe mental or physical disability.

Beginning in October 1939, public health authorities began to encourage parents of children with disabilities to admit their young children to one of a number of specially designated pediatric clinics throughout Germany and Austria. The clinics were in reality children’s killing wards where specially recruited medical staff murdered their young charges by lethal overdoses of medication or by starvation.

At first, medical professionals and clinic administrators incorporated only infants and toddlers in the operation, but as the scope of the measure widened, they included juveniles up to 17 years of age. Conservative estimates suggest that at least 5,000 physically and mentally disabled German children perished as a result of the child euthanasia program during the war years.

The end result of this program is a mystery to no one.

Many have questioned just what role women played in the rise and brutality of Nazi Germany. In researching the details I stumbled upon a fantastic summary of this subject, which I will share with you now:

“Although Germany had been one of the most progressive feminist societies during the early twentieth century, women generally acquiesced to Hitler’s desires. Many women experienced the implementation of Nazi gender policies not as aggression against women but as a welcome return to traditional values (Gellately 2001, 10-11). The elevation and reverence of motherhood showed the regime’s antifeminism was not inherently antiwoman. Some Nazi party officials did not hide their hostility toward women. Their insulting rhetoric was often discounted, however, either as exceptional in an otherwise agreeable party platform or because the impassioned speeches of the true leader of the Nazi Party, Adolf Hitler, made clear his sympathy for the plight of women (Koonz 1987, 58-61). Many women found comfort in the ideals of the Nazi Party that relegated women’s lives to the private sphere of Kinder, Kirche, Kuche (children, church, kitchen).

Although the Nazi ideal was for women to get married and create large families, many women were unable to do so. The overall surplus of women in Germany and the lack of available men on the home front meant that many German women were single during the war. Most of these women, especially those from the lower classes, were employed before and during the war. The state targeted those who had escaped employment for recruiting drives, with limited success.

Prior to the war, married women were encouraged to leave the workforce to start or expand families. The government gave financial support based on family size. To women in low-paying jobs, with working husbands, significant government assistance in exchange for unemployment was a good deal. The success of the program has often been debated. Although many married women left the labor force, the overall percentage of women employed in Germany was far higher than in Great Britain or the United States (Gellately 2001, 151).

During the war, unemployed married women who did not have children often created a great deal of resentment among those who were forcibly employed. Women of the lower class, even those with young children, could not afford to live off government benefits.

Following long hours of work, working women had to stand in long lines for their rations, while unemployed women were able to get the choicest provisions.

Most of those unemployed, childless women had the financial means not to work, giving the resentment clear class undertones. Attempts to recruit those women were largely unsuccessful, in part because the Nazi leadership refused to make employment compulsory (Noakes and Pridham 2000, 316-325).

Rather than force married women and mothers into employment, the Nazi regime imported millions of prisoners of war and slave laborers from conquered and satellite nations. Extensive efforts were made to prevent foreign workers from defiling the German women who shared common workspace. The vast majority of the Gestapo’s manpower was directed at controlling foreign workers and preventing relationships with German women (Gellately 2001, 152). As the war dragged on and times became more desperate, some women did form sexual relationships with non-German men. Many of the denunciations made against women to the Gestapo involved charges of sexual relations with foreigners (Gellately 2001, 197).

Many women found an outlet for their creativity and leadership through work in Nazi social organizations. The umbrella organization for women was the National Socialist Frauen-schaft/Deutsches Frauenwerk (Women’s Organization/Women’s Work, NSF/DFW). Led by Gertrud Scholtz-Klink, the NSF/DFW acted as a policing organization for women, its main task to indoctrinate, train, control, and organize German women for the needs of the state. Although part of the Nazi Party apparatus, the NSF/DFW did not provide women with avenues to influence political decisions. The leaders within the organizations were given power to operate within the sphere of women but were always subordinate to the command of the male-dominated party. Despite the lack of real power, women participated in the programs of the antifeminist Nazi state in far greater numbers than in the Weimar Republic, which had first enfranchised them (Grunberger 1995, 258). For the most part, women found that the organizations served as support networks, gave them activities to feel useful in the war effort, and provided social benefits for the community.

I’m not going to wax all poetic on the similarities and differences between then and now. I leave the reader to draw their own conclusions. What i will do, however, is say with unmitigated conviction that this sort of thing most definitely CAN happen again…and now, and here. It happened again in Europe barely 50 years after WW2 in Bosnia (see Adam Jones’ “Effacing the Male”), it happened in Somalia, and it happens on a smaller scale all the time all over the world.

This is History staring us in the face. It’s trying to tell us something. Is the fear of ridicule really all it takes for this to happen again?

They say that those who forget History are doomed to repeat it. I’m firmly convinced that this is so, which is why I don’t accept the stance of people who wish to dismiss arguments based on how wacky they sound. In my estimation, people like that aren’t worth the time it takes to respond.

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  • http://www.facebook.com/kyle.posada Frank_Jeeves

    Other then the welfare system, the women’s organizations and the fourth trimester abortions I’m not entirely making the connections. Can you help me out?

  • the hermit

    have you ever heard about the need for “smashing the patriarchy”?

    Well they say patriarchy but they mean “men”, looking for a scapegoat, responsible for all the worlds problems…. is not that familiar?

  • Wolverine1568

    Take a look at this link. Tell me what you think.

    freemanITOBA.com

    Focus in on the videos of a man named Dean Clifford.

  • lensman

    You know, it’s only a matter of time before some idiot links to this post and starts screaming “Godwin’s Law” without him/her realising that Godwin’s Law doesn’t apply if the direct nature of the subject discussed is Nazism.

    Excellent Article! Very well researched, and very well articulated! It blew me away!

    I do however want to clear something up for those that might speed-read it so that they don’t get the wrong idea.

    What Nazis did (and now feminism attempts to do) was NOT Natural Selection. It was Human Selection aka eugenics.

    What’s the difference? Well, the difference is that Natural Selection is based solely on survival. Subjects that survive enough to reproduce pass on their traits to the next generation plain and simple. Human Selection on the other hand is based on what characteristics humans find desirable and want to preserve or multiply.

    Both Human Selection and Natural Selection are mechanisms for evolution. To put it simply, Natural selection doesn’t have an agenda or purpose. Human Selection on the other hand does. While Natural Selection leads to “positive” evolution ie one where the organism is adjusted to its environment, Human Selection can, and often does, destroy the species in which it is subjected to.

    A good example of the negative consequences of human selection is Dog Breeding which has led to races of dogs like the Shar-Pei and the Bulldog which has severe health problems. The problem with Human Selection is that while we view a trait as desirable it doesn’t mean that it’s really beneficial.

    In the end Nazis practised Human Selection not Natural Selection. In the conference where “The Final Solution” was decided, it was mentioned specifically that the Jews which were located in the concentration camps and survived their terrible ordeals, would give rise to a stronger race, precisely because they survived harsh conditions. Therefore they would all have to die in order to prevent the rise of a new stronger Jewish race. Again, Natural Selection had nothing to do with this. It was all Human Selection based on what some people wanted.

    Hitler’s and the Nazi views on Natural Selection were skewed. They didn’t understand it and they didn’t attempt to understand it, they just cherry-picked what they wanted out of it and used it as a “scientific justification” for their atrocities.

    Another eerie analog of Feminists and Nazis is that they do the same thing as far as “Science” is concerned. They quote bogus articles and statistics and try to justify that they are somehow better than other people. They quote things like the dissapearing Y chromosome (debunked) in order to claim some sort of genetic superiority. And when somebody actually does research and doesn’t find something that they agree with, they discredit him by screaming “sexist” (akin to the “Juden” mantra), and getting him destroyed -instead of, you know, actually doing a counterstudy, or pointing logical flaws in methodology…

    …I guess true science is hard for feminists.

    • Alfred E

      I’d love to hear more about the Nazi science and the tie in with feminism. Do you have any links or maybe written an article on this? I bet Paul would be interested in running it if you did. It is mind blowing how feminists have been so brash and bold in their bastardization of scientific method and their tendency to withhold anything that might go against their ideology. I simply can’t believe that other scientists outside of Strauss aren’t highly critical of their intentional rape of scientific method.

      • http://manamongoaks.com/index.html Ray

        http://mensnewsdaily.com/archive/a-b/blumhorst/2004/blumhorst06704.htm

        Some of the links in this story led to articles discussing ties between Nazi eugenics.and California. It’s old so some links may be non-functional.

      • lensman

        I have actually written a thesis, but it’s in Greek. A part of it deals with the relationship between evolution and the Nazi party, or rather how the misconception of the theory of evolution lead to the atrocities of the second world war. Here is a summary of what I wrote. I’ll try to be brief.

        The precursor to all of Nazis’ pseudoscience was the work of Sir Francis Galton, Darwin’s cousin, who officially termed the word “Eugenics”. Galton was actually a pretty good scientist and researcher with plenty of publications to his name, but he was obsessed with the “Quality of the Human Race”, and believed that people with superior traits should have more descendants. He made a study called “The Heredity of Genius” which was based on a flimsy questionnaire, and a subsequent evaluation of “High Class Families”. The data was interpreted in a way that suited his beliefs (for instance he refers to “a good painter judging from the price of his work today”) and is heavily scrutinized. Nevertheless, it was later taken seriously by people like Winston Churchill who were concerned with the declining quality of their people.

        Charles Davenport, took his queue from Galton and established a eugenics program in the USA which sterilized over 60’000 people based on traits that were considered undesirable.

        The official “scientific basis” of the Nazi Party was a study made in 1921 by Erwin Baur, Fritz Lenz and Eügen Fischer which “proved” that the Germans through Darwinian selection had superior skills in leadership, civilization and athletics. But the race was now being poluted by lower races that damaged the German gene pool. The “science” of that study was questionable at best, but it pleased the ears of the Germans that read it who now had a new goal: the cleanness of the German race. Charles Davenport’s work and sterilization techniques was a major influence on the way the Nazi party would act afterwards.

        Try as I might I couldn’t find a copy of the original 1921 study, but the book “Racial Hygiene: Medicine under the Nazis” does a good job of covering it as well as how science was perceived by the Nazi. It’s available on Google Books, if you want to take a read. You can also find a good abstract of it here.

        Not surprisingly, those three guys were especially revered by the Nazi party and rose to important places after Hitler rose to power. Fischer became the Dean of the University of Berlin and proudly claimed in one of his speeches that “what Darwin didn’t do we made into reality”. What literature, scientific or not, did not agree with the official party line was characterized as “Jewish” or “Anti-German” and banned. You couldn’t quote it or reference it. Neither could you conduct a counter-study to it, unless you were guaranteed to find things that agreed with the party line.

        Much like Dan, I’ll leave the reader to reach his conclusions on the matter… There are many interesting parallels between the way Nazis treated science and scientists and how feminists pervert science now.

        OK, references:

        http://mandelproject.us/RacialHygiene.pdf
        http://www.eugenicsarchive.org/eugenics/topics_fs.pl?theme=41&search=&matches=
        “A Life of Sir Francis Galton” by Nicholas Wright Gillham
        “Racial hygiene: medicine under the Nazis” by Robert Proctor
        “Encyclopedia of the Holocaust” by Israel Gutman
        Kuhl, S. “The Nazi Connection; Eugenics, American Racism, and German National Socialism” (New York, Oxford UP, 1994)

        You can find most of these books and articles on-line. If you can’t (most of them were on file-sharing hosts and I don’t know If they are still active), I happen to have a copy of them on my hard drive. Maybe I can upload them somewhere.

  • Alfred E

    Great piece Dan. I have always wondered about the state of pre-war germany. Thanks for the excellent info and for tying some things together. It is amazing how pliable a population becomes when they are in the midst of economic problems. Whatever scapegoat is available gets the ax. We all know in our culture what scapegoat is primed and ready to be sent into the desert with the sins of all over his head. No one will care. Here’s a hint….it ain’t women, minorities or gays…

    • andybob

      “Whatever scapegoat is available gets the ax. We all know in our culture what scapegoat is primed and ready to be sent into the desert…it ain’t women, minorities or gays…”

      Really? While the Nazis rounded up Jews, sent them to concentration camps and stamped yellow Stars of David on their uniforms, the same thing happened to male homosexuals (except they were stamped with pink triangles). Didn’t matter. The ID was removed when they were all sent together to die in the gas ovens. Societies throughout time have never hesitated to target and scapegoat gay men, throwing us under the nearest bus/carriage/chariot. Lesbians, on the other hand,…

      • http://menzmagazine.blogspot.com/ Dan Moore (Factory)

        Actually, that’s a good point. I knew that gays were rounded up too, but failed to mention it specifically. And frankly, I should have.

        Thanks for catching me on that one.

      • Mingtian

        Actually I heard that the Nazis didn’t mind gays as long as they were the butch, masculine type and even encouraged it (See: Pink Swastika). I don’t know if it’s 100% true but still interesting.

        Yes, many societies have thrown gay men under the bus(unfortunately) but not all. A lot of societies in ancient Greece (and etc.) encouraged homosexuality. There is even talk that Alexander the Great (and other big time leaders) was bi or gay, now this is not a bad thing, just interesting. Gays haven’t always been thrown under the bus (fortunately).

  • Introspectre

    Excellent work Dan, and you’re right, feminism is history looking to repeat itself. It’s the latest permutation, of the dark side of human biology and psychology, coupled with the ruling classes perpetual encouragement and support, of tyrannical control mechanism’s.

  • JinnBottle

    Good article. It was educational for me, and I consider myself relatively very knowledgeable re Nazism, Hitler, etc.

    But I would have to say, after reading Nathanson & Young, Hoff Sommers, Patai, Paglia, and many others on the feminist List of Banned Books, that while there certainly are many parallels from Nazism to Feminism, I see Communism and Feminism as an even better fit: with “Communism” meaning the Soviet variety in particular. From Marx’s – and, even more, *Engels* – theories – to Lennin’s hardline turn to force & brutality in Russia (at least partly because of his bruised ego, by the way) – to Stalin’s complete Sovietization (i.e nationalizings) of the several Soviet states, and his bringing the reliance on might over right to its zenith and logical conclusion – I’ve seen this as drawing even more parallels than “simple” fascism.

    If you don’t have the patience to read Marx, Engels, Lennin, etc in the originals (I don’t – not even Marx’s short book there, the Manifesto!), do definitely read the authors mentioned above, if you haven’t already. I used to dismiss anyone who used the word “Marxism” as a (Cold) War-mongering, reactionary shit…No more! I still don’t use the word lightly, but Feminism is an almost perfect parallel – merely replacing “The Workers” with “Women”.

    • lensman

      I actually believe that Stalin was much more fearsome and brutal that Hitler. To point, whereas Hitler’s policies led to the death of over 6 million Jews, Stalin’s policies resulted in the deaths of over 50 million of his own people. It’s easy to see who was worse as far as body-count is concerned. Plus, drawing parallels between feminism and Stalin’s policies prevents certain idiots from shouting “Godwin’s Law”.

      Much like Nazism, communism and Stalin’s policies also did a perversion of science. Again what scientists published research that didn’t agree with the official party’s line were censored, banned or worse. Interestingly enough, this time the theory of evolution via Natural Selection was banned as it didn’t exactly sit right with Stalin and replaced with Lysenkoism which advocated the inheritance of acquired characteristics ala Lamarck. This caused the science of genetics in the USSR to go back several hundred years. It also caused a major famine and had other serious repercussions.

    • http://menzmagazine.blogspot.com/ Dan Moore (Factory)

      My point wasn’t really so much that ‘right wing’ groups are about to take over, or that they have, or anything like that. As far as I’m concerned there was precious little difference between Stalin and Hitler, and their ideologies. Both essentially were totalitarian states with power concentrated in the elites. All they really differed on was the methods used to establish this state.

      Kind of like the ‘left’ and the ‘right’ today, in fact.

      I believe exploration along the ‘what about Stalin’ angle will serve to draw even more parallels to today….

  • keyster

    What really led to Pre-war Germany’s demise and the vacuum left for the Nazi Party to fill was hyper-inflation. They simply printed more money when they ran out. That was their monetary policy, infuse the country with printed currency. People had to use wheelbarrows to haul cash around just to go shopping for necessities.

    That the Jews played a large part in banking and lending, as they had for centuries, didn’t help their cause any. Besides they were not “native aryan”, easily identified and tended to be clannish.

    I think the greatest similarity between Nazism and Feminism is the highly adept use of propoganda and masterful control of the media. It’s to the point now where most women would not even identify themselves as feminist, yet live the life and reap the benefits of it. That’s how intrinsically entwined it’s become in our psyche.

    As far as right vs. left, we talk about polarization and a divided country, but what we’ve always had is a check and balance system; that one ideology should never fully dominate over the other. This is why Americans vote for gridlock. And so the balance of power slightly seesaws back and forth over each election cycle. There could come a time however when it sees or saws very hard in one direction and stays there. That’s Nazi Germany all over again…right or left.

    • Promoman

      You got that right. Hitler pulled the ultimate demagogue move and did a power grab when Germany was at its shittiest after The Treaty of Versailles.

      • http://menzmagazine.blogspot.com/ Dan Moore (Factory)

        Hitler was going to win the next election, and they knew it. So the elites thought by placing him in power ‘illegitimately’ they would have some form of hold over the man. Better to place him in with hope of restraint than let him take power on his own terms.

        Ooops.

    • http://menzmagazine.blogspot.com/ Dan Moore (Factory)

      Exactly, it’s not a Left or Right thing…it’s a Totalitarian thing. And the use of Propaganda you refer to is one of the main things I see too. They even use the same damn justification for much of the time (“For the good of the children’)…

  • Rocco

    The situation is dangerous and your right Factory. Growing up we knew that this the Holocost would probably be repeated because the German people are not inherently evil, it’s a whole country.

    This could happen anywhere and, back then, we new that the synergy of mass transportation, mass killing machines and ignorance were what led up to the holocost. The Germans were just very efficient.

    Since then many repeats have occured, inculding the Hutu’s and Tutsi’s and the Cambodians.

    So, when men noticed that the daughters of eugenics, our feminists have political hegemony and when men pointed out they are being oppressed we got….even more oppression and how this could lead to a nazi like disaster feminists invented “Godwins law”.

    As you say, can we allow sticks and stones, and words, from being vigilant and stopping a second holocost?

    I don’t think so. Men are so brainwashed that they literally will go to their doom and when told they have to pay for it men say…oh, I have to get a second job.

    • http://menzmagazine.blogspot.com/ Dan Moore (Factory)

      I think it’s important to make sure men at least have an idea what’s going on. If they choose to laugh it off…well, then they cannot be reached I suppose…

  • ZenCo.

    I’m sure I’ll get beat up for this, but here goes: It seems to me that the Nazi Party of the mid-30’s parallels the Tea Party movement of today in two vital ways:
    Firstly, the scapegoating of others (immigrants, gays, liberals (which includes artists, musicians, intellectuals, etc.) muslims, etc) without having a fucking clue as to a POSITIVE plan or idea for cleaning up eight years of tax-and-spend Neocons.
    Secondly, this idea of some pre-60’s utopia of perfect WHITE contentment (that didn’t really exist) of church-going Protestants that included June Cleaver in an apron and a white picket fence. I’d rather have a truck-load of scrap metal dumped on my kneecaps than live in a conformist nightmare like that.
    Just watch on YouTube some of the Tea Party rallies – you ‘ll see what I mean: Shaven-headed ‘Joe The Plumber’ white knights raising their fists in paroxisms of hatred in cadence with their ‘charasmatic leader’. Disgusting
    All of this while grabbing their ankles for the corporate elite who fuck them, royally, up the ass.
    If scapegoating others was a main driver of Nazi fascism (as I bellieve it was).then the Far-Right politics of today are a slam dunk replacement.

    • http://menzmagazine.blogspot.com/ Dan Moore (Factory)

      When you own both sides of the aisle, who wins is unimportant. What IS important, is that the people demand swift, decisive action.

    • keyster

      I hadn’t heard the Tea Party “scapegoating” any specific identifiable group other than politicians from either party that insist on spending money we don’t have. But then I rarely tune into liberal propaganda regarding how “the Tea Party is a bunch of racist homophobes out to destroy America”. Don’t you see your own kind is demagoguing the Tea Party, exactly as you (falsely) claim the Tea Party is doing against your favorite “groups”!

      Hating on the Tea Party is meant to unify democrats to vote democratic, like hating on Jews was meant to “get out the vote” for the Third Reich in the 1930’s.

      In other words you’re willing to believe the liberal propaganda meant to “freeze” the Tea Party as the reason for all the problem in DC, without ever having been to a Tea Party meeting or looked at their beliefs. Kinda like hating on Jews without ever having been to a Bar Mitzvah, but I digress, only slightly.

      As I’ve said ZenCo you’re a walking contradiction; a card carrying liberal…who’s pro-men’s rights.
      Feminist governance is to liberals what the Gestapo was to the Nazis.
      Without a pro-woman agenda and the female vote the democratic party falls.
      Pick a side already.

    • http://manamongoaks.com/index.html Ray

      Your comments sound like kind of an ignorant hate rant to me. You falsely accuse the Tea Party of stereotyping, but it’s you who are doing all the stereotyping as far as I can see. Additionally, the Tea party has nothing to do with “Socialism,” especially “National Socialism,” but I’ve seen Obama’s Socialist agenda “nationalize,” or attempt to “nationalize:” health care, banks, the auto industry, educational loans, etc. As most of us know, in the acronym you refer to, the NA comes from National and the ZI comes from Socialist.

      • keyster

        If you read the DailyKOS, the Huff Post and watched Bill Mahr or Jon Stewart you’d understand exactly where he’s coming from. The church of liberalism preaches to its unquestioning masses, in movies and from lecturnes , entertainers and academics; be cool or be cast out.

    • Mingtian

      Actually Muslims sided with Adolf Hitler during WW2.

  • http://truthjusticeca.wordpress.com/ Denis

    Interesting lesson in history but you could probably make a similar historical comparison to any other social movement that sought to marginalize a segment of society. Certainly women enjoy far more freedom and choices in our feminist utopia than Nazi germany. Their motives and objectives were also completely different.

  • ZenCo.

    @Keyster
    Just who the hell are you to exhort me to, “pick a side”?
    I’ll pick whatever side, or not, I damn well feel like.
    Just because you lack the intellectual capacity to see behind your extremely myopic political world views doesn’t mean everyone else has to be like you. ‘Cause, guess what, Ace? They’re not.
    The MRM, FIRST AND FOREMOST, is about basic humanity and human rights. It’s not about your political views which I believe, personally, are extremely naive and childish.
    I wouldn’t drink your ‘Tea-BAG’ Kool-Aid with a gun to my head. Nonetheless, we’re supposed to be on the same side of this issue here. Grow the hell up and stop trying to tell people what their politics need to be to be a REAL MRA like you.

    • http://truthjusticeca.wordpress.com/ Denis

      Personally, I like the Tea Party for various reasons but I think your point of scapegoating others is relevant. All political parties do it, left and right have their own scapegoats.

      However, my political preferences are secondary and irrelevant to men’s rights.

    • keyster

      And now for the rebuttle in classic ad hominem form…
      Thank you ZenCo!

  • ZenCo.

    @Keyster
    Wrong sir. No personal attacks were made other than showing the obvious over-reach of YOUR personal politics. Get with it. This is not the forum for such. This IS (supposedly) a forum for men. ALL men who have been denied their basic freedoms – Left or Right.
    I launched no such personal attack, other than vehemently disagreeing with you.
    Wake up.

    • http://truthjusticeca.wordpress.com/ Denis

      Yeah maybe just a little bit, but I think it’s important to take a step back and understand the pervasiveness of political stereotypes, liberals are all this, conservatives are all that, tea partiers are racist. feminists are this, mras are that, women are this, men are that. Everybody is an individual with a different spectrum in various shades of colors. Personally, I’d prefer if they put their other agendas secondary to men’s rights. How did this all get started anyway? Ah, it’s not important.

      • http://menzmagazine.blogspot.com/ Dan Moore (Factory)

        “Yeah maybe just a little bit, but I think it’s important to take a step back and understand the pervasiveness of political stereotypes, liberals are all this, conservatives are all that, tea partiers are racist. feminists are this, mras are that, women are this, men are that. ”

        ….now, have a look again at the article, where it says something about the public becoming more and more polarized, more radical, in their political views…..

        And who was put in power because of it…

  • ZenCo.

    @Denis
    Thanks for not piling on. Yeah, you’re right – I brought out the pimp-hand a little strongly.
    It’s lonely being me, here, sometimes.
    I get angry because I feel, deep down, that this movement has no real chance unless ALL men are welcomed. I don’t feel this is the case at times. Too much identity politics and personal ideology for this to go more mainstream. This is a mistake. A fatal one, perhaps.
    Some of the men here need to realize that the USA is huge; geographically as well as culturally.
    Blue collar guys in NYC, Boston, Jersey, etc. will mostly be and vote Democrat. That doesn’t mean they don’t get screwed-over the same as the rest of us. If men like that can be reached, then this movement will skyrocket. I know this because I know these guys, and believe me – NONE of them are or like PC bullshit.
    This also means that trying to get them to vote Republican, or TEA-PARTY will close them down before reading a word.
    Just my $0.02 from where I live…

    • http://truthjusticeca.wordpress.com/ Denis

      I’m not much into partisan politics and I don’t think the right or left are offering any solutions to men’s problems. I’m often disturbed by the lack of concern on all sides and among men especially. I don’t think creating political divisions is productive and I don’t think picking sides is good for MRM politics. I think it’s better to play coy with both sides, stick to relevant men’s issues and be all inclusive. There aren’t many men’s sites like that but I’m sure I read about something like it at AVfM before.

      • ZenCo.

        Well, I don’t know about being “coy”, but my philosophy is: We can go back to hating each other once our common goals are met.
        That about sums it up for me.

        • http://truthjusticeca.wordpress.com/ Denis

          We’re going to be old and grey before we get close to our goals being met. You’ll notice that I was mostly agreeing with you in rebuking Keyster, although I generally also agree with him a lot too. Keyster makes me uncomfortable at times, particularly his comment about blacks at the spearhead. If it’s blacks own fault then maybe we should just blame men for all our problems too huh? It’s the canary in the coal mine and it’s just a matter of time before us white boys become ghettoized and start our own gangs. That’s everyones future.

          I would have commented if I hadn’t been banned. Quite the crowd there, makes you wonder what it takes to get banned, like maybe exposing lies.

          I just don’t feel that I fit well into any stereotype and men frustrate me.

        • http://menzmagazine.blogspot.com/ Dan Moore (Factory)

          “Well, I don’t know about being “coy”, but my philosophy is: We can go back to hating each other once our common goals are met.
          That about sums it up for me.”

          Welcome to the ‘planned obsolescence’ of the MRM….

    • http://menzmagazine.blogspot.com/ Dan Moore (Factory)

      There are a lot of people trying to INJECT identity politics into the MRM, but if you watch the mainstays and Big Guys(tm) you’ll see that thinking for oneself, and reaching your own conclusions, is highly prized in the MRM ‘elite’ as it were.

      More often than not, the one saying shit like “You’re not a real MRA!” is a poser himself.

  • KatieCaliente

    Recently, I re-read Robert Bork’s novel ( im aware it isnt a novel–thats my sense of humour at work)
    “Slouching towards Gomarrah” and happened to read “the Unabomber Manifesto”
    Both writers seemed to feel “feminism” is result of TECHNOLOGY.
    I believe Aaron Russo was a rockefeller agent, as far as his lies about feminism—im open to the idea the rockefeller family believes they created Feminism…it cant benefit them in their social strata, and I dare say its amusing to them in everyday life—unless they are homosexual?
    do you like Feminism?
    Ever hear a homosexual complain about it?
    Do most people even know the word?
    Anyway, all this social unrest will work out. All that must be done is to eliminate racial lines in your everyday dealings. If you are aware and have your senses up, you can alert another man to the situation—be they black or white, or what have you.
    The situation here is particularly against MEN.
    It used to be BLACK MEN.
    The idea that the particular dynamics of a social situation can change is lost of many folks!
    Women do not have the mental compacity to repair machines, cut down trees, and a host of enginerring feats. They will die in certain situations. They also dont invent very much, cant fly fighter planes, cant cook as well as myself apparently…not sure if men have always been better cooks?

    Anyway, I enjoy reading on Bauhaus and degenerative Art and all those topics, but what I wish to stress is that the situation isnt as bleak as you might think.
    Women are aware of the homosexual nature of feminism and ashamed.
    They are not happy.
    Feminism is an evolutionary backstep….and the only women who like it are the sociopathic ones who need to tell someone…anyone…about their victimhood….and the lesbian faction.
    “The Inevitabilty of Patriarchy” is a book that needs closer examination here….im not sure the reprecusions my ultimate ideas will bring….namely, that by force, women should be put back in their gender role.
    e Islam will do that for me, i see it, and am getting out of the way. Manginas follow me from coast to coast, watching me walk my dog—and creepily sitting behind my car, whilst im in a car wash.

    These manginas are responding to the promptings of women in their government, and I think one needs to look no further than the murders committed by Janet Reno against the Waco nutters, to see the potential dangerousness I could face. Although, I dont own weapons, and only have my mate. Still, these men do not question the roles given to them by a feminized military…a most henoius ending–even by canon fodder standards!
    How many men will march on IED’s and whatnot before reverting to “manhood”?
    and, if they cant or won’t…fuck em. Let them die.
    Stupidity is hardly a conspiracy.
    Just recently, I was reading a young black man’s blog—on “The Jezebel Spirit” ! He made the profound Theological statement–“What if what we often put down as our sista’s actions as SIN is actually EVIL.” Something like that. I guess the sistas ran him out of church for saying “pussy” or something Trivial.
    In the same way, would we call the actions of these Nazi’s sin?
    or is it properly thought of as Evil?
    Perhaps killing the people you dont like is extreme, and too many times today, the Nazi party is readjusted by folks to fit their perameters of what it represents.
    Is there a non-violent way to kick these women out of power?
    and dare i say, the manginas who love them?